Computer Graphics with Photoshop - Which tablet for an amateur?

Author

Which tablet for an amateur?

Burt Johnson

2007-10-02, 10:14 pm

I am not really an artist. Without a ruler, I can't come close to a
straight line, and my portraits are stick figures. I know my way around
Photoshop reasonably well in a purely technical way. That is, I have
used it to create and edit user interface elements, and can modify
photoographs at an advanced amateur level.

I am about to delve more seriously into digital photography. I was deep
into it in the 70's, with a bedroom converted into a darkroom where I
performed my magic for special effects. I am thinking of doing that
again, with photoshop replacing the darkroom, and my shiny new Canon 5D
camera.

I am tempted to get a Wacom tablet, to see where it can help.

Question 1: Is a tablet even useful for someone like me?

Question 2: Assuming #1 is 'yes', which tablet would you recommend?

Photoshop TV episode 98 ( the one shot at Photoshop World) gave a brief
hype for a sexy Intuos Limited Edition 6X11, which the Wacom site says
is "for serious photographers."

The $409 price tag is not out of reach, but I don't want to spend it
only to later find I don't really use it...

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

The Twisted Pixel

2007-10-03, 3:14 am

"Burt Johnson" <burt@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
news:1i5d9ha.1o8x23w1q3u03wN%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
>I am not really an artist. Without a ruler, I can't come close to a
> straight line, and my portraits are stick figures. I know my way around
> Photoshop reasonably well in a purely technical way. That is, I have
> used it to create and edit user interface elements, and can modify
> photoographs at an advanced amateur level.
>
> I am about to delve more seriously into digital photography. I was deep
> into it in the 70's, with a bedroom converted into a darkroom where I
> performed my magic for special effects. I am thinking of doing that
> again, with photoshop replacing the darkroom, and my shiny new Canon 5D
> camera.
>
> I am tempted to get a Wacom tablet, to see where it can help.
>
> Question 1: Is a tablet even useful for someone like me?
>
> Question 2: Assuming #1 is 'yes', which tablet would you recommend?
>
> Photoshop TV episode 98 ( the one shot at Photoshop World) gave a brief
> hype for a sexy Intuos Limited Edition 6X11, which the Wacom site says
> is "for serious photographers."
>
> The $409 price tag is not out of reach, but I don't want to spend it
> only to later find I don't really use it...
>
>
> --
> - Burt Johnson
> MindStorm, Inc.
> http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

Wacom's new Bamboo line is quite nice both in features and looks and they
can be hand for less than $100.

Al Dykes

2007-10-03, 3:14 am

In article <470306c1$0$14143$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>,
The Twisted Pixel <lavaville@USA.com> wrote:
>"Burt Johnson" <burt@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
>news:1i5d9ha.1o8x23w1q3u03wN%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
>
>
>Wacom's new Bamboo line is quite nice both in features and looks and they
>can be hand for less than $100.
>
>

A friend who is a graphic artist, computer geek and photoshop pro went
and bought the biggest Wacom pad figuring bigger is better. She found
herself not using it due to desk space. She got the little one and
loves it. The big work area on the large pad didn't add anything.

--
a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m
Don't blame me. I voted for Gore. A Proud signature since 2001

Burt Johnson

2007-10-03, 3:14 am

Al Dykes <adykes@panix.com> wrote:

>
> A friend who is a graphic artist, computer geek and photoshop pro went
> and bought the biggest Wacom pad figuring bigger is better. She found
> herself not using it due to desk space. She got the little one and
> loves it. The big work area on the large pad didn't add anything.

Interesting. I presume there is a 1-to-1 relation between points on the
pad and points on my screen, right? Doesn't that mean that a smaller pad
gives me lower resolution? I have two 24" monitors. Trying to map that
to a 5X8 or whatever sounds like it wouldn't work all that well...?

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

Mike Russell

2007-10-03, 3:14 am

"Burt Johnson" <burt@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
news:1i5dk56.1fuvj70pevv9cN%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
[re wacom tablet size]
> Interesting. I presume there is a 1-to-1 relation between points on the
> pad and points on my screen, right? Doesn't that mean that a smaller pad
> gives me lower resolution? I have two 24" monitors. Trying to map that
> to a 5X8 or whatever sounds like it wouldn't work all that well...?

This does not turn out to be a problem. The resolution is several thousand
ppi, much higher than the display resolution.
--
Mike Russell - www.curvemeister.com

Bigguy

2007-10-03, 6:14 pm

Burt Johnson wrote:
> I am not really an artist. Without a ruler, I can't come close to a
> straight line, and my portraits are stick figures. I know my way around
> Photoshop reasonably well in a purely technical way. That is, I have
> used it to create and edit user interface elements, and can modify
> photoographs at an advanced amateur level.
>
> I am about to delve more seriously into digital photography. I was deep
> into it in the 70's, with a bedroom converted into a darkroom where I
> performed my magic for special effects. I am thinking of doing that
> again, with photoshop replacing the darkroom, and my shiny new Canon 5D
> camera.
>
> I am tempted to get a Wacom tablet, to see where it can help.
>
> Question 1: Is a tablet even useful for someone like me?
>
> Question 2: Assuming #1 is 'yes', which tablet would you recommend?
>
> Photoshop TV episode 98 ( the one shot at Photoshop World) gave a brief
> hype for a sexy Intuos Limited Edition 6X11, which the Wacom site says
> is "for serious photographers."
>
> The $409 price tag is not out of reach, but I don't want to spend it
> only to later find I don't really use it...
>
>
Wacom Volito 2 is a good cheap tablet... been using a couple for years now.

Guy

Al Dykes

2007-10-03, 6:14 pm

In article <5mhet3FdijlhU1@mid.individual.net>,
Bigguy <bigguy36@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:
>Burt Johnson wrote:
>Wacom Volito 2 is a good cheap tablet... been using a couple for years now.
>
>Guy

I think I saw a a new line of Wacom pads with some under $100 in the
store yesterday.

A year+ ago, my friend did a quick evaluation of no-name graphic pads
as part of a project and decided that Wacom was worth teh price for
reasons from build-quality to the quality of the associated software.

Now I see a bunch of cheap pads in the store and maybe it's time to
have another evaluation.

--
a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m
Don't blame me. I voted for Gore. A Proud signature since 2001

Larry

2007-10-03, 6:14 pm

Mike Russell wrote:
> "Burt Johnson" <burt@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
> news:1i5dk56.1fuvj70pevv9cN%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
> [re wacom tablet size]
>
> This does not turn out to be a problem. The resolution is several thousand
> ppi, much higher than the display resolution.

I have to disagree (and I have the greatest respect for you and your
abilities). I am in a similar situation as the OP, particularly in that
I have absolutely no graphics talent, but I probably share the same
photographic experience. I read the same tablet thread earlier and
blindly went out and got an WACOM Intuos 9 x 12 tablet. Well, perhaps
not blindly, I tried a few at a friends house. You're right about
resolution, but in a two monitor setup (I have 2 NEC 20" monitors), with
the artist (if you can even call me that) having no or damn little
graphics talent, the larger pads seem to let you handle things better,
or at least easier. It is much easier to "draw" smoothly. I don't know
how to express that properly, Mike, but I'd tell the OP to try different
sizes first. Yes, the large tablet is a PITA on your desk, but the
control across two monitors makes it essential at least for me. Also,
it is MUCH easier to "fix" your mistakes, particularly with Photoshop.

Burt, try a few different sizes and see what you think. That new Bamboo
line might be just what you need. I couldn't find a larger one to try
so I bought the Intuos. Btw, masking is just super with a tablet - SO
much better than a mouse. There's probably a lot more things that are
better, but my experience so far is limited.

Another btw: I am told that if you use Photoshop (or Fireworks) on one
monitor and something else (Dreamweaver in my case) on the other, you
can limit the tablet to the Photoshop monitor, thereby doubling the
effective resolution. I haven't done that yet, but one of these days
I'm going to try it.

--

Larry
rapp at lmr dot com

Larry

2007-10-03, 6:14 pm

ronviers@gmail.com

2007-10-03, 6:14 pm

On Oct 3, 10:44 am, Larry <inva...@invalid.com> wrote:

> I have to disagree (and I have the greatest respect for you and your
> abilities). I am in a similar situation as the OP, particularly in that
> I have absolutely no graphics talent, but I probably share the same
> photographic experience. I read the same tablet thread earlier and
> blindly went out and got an WACOM Intuos 9 x 12 tablet. Well, perhaps
> not blindly, I tried a few at a friends house. You're right about
> resolution, but in a two monitor setup (I have 2 NEC 20" monitors), with
> the artist (if you can even call me that) having no or damn little
> graphics talent, the larger pads seem to let you handle things better,
> or at least easier. It is much easier to "draw" smoothly. I don't know
> how to express that properly, Mike, but I'd tell the OP to try different
> sizes first. Yes, the large tablet is a PITA on your desk, but the
> control across two monitors makes it essential at least for me. Also,
> it is MUCH easier to "fix" your mistakes, particularly with Photoshop.

> Larry
> rapp at lmr dot com

I use a 4x5 Intuos with two monitors and I am glad it is not any
bigger than it is. Personally I don't like moving my arm any more than
necessary - it is unnatural for me.

Psygnosis - Silent Running

2007-10-03, 10:14 pm

"Al Dykes" <adykes@panix.com> wrote in message
news:fdv3np$l6h$1@panix5.panix.com...
> In article <470306c1$0$14143$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>,
> The Twisted Pixel <lavaville@USA.com> wrote:
>
>
> A friend who is a graphic artist, computer geek and photoshop pro went
> and bought the biggest Wacom pad figuring bigger is better. She found
> herself not using it due to desk space. She got the little one and
> loves it. The big work area on the large pad didn't add anything.
>
> --
> a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m
> Don't blame me. I voted for Gore. A Proud signature since 2001

I think the only time the larger ones (beyond 6x8) are is for CAD work and
art creation is something like Corel Painter. For photo editing, etc. the
small ones are just fine and the new Wacom Bamboo ones not only look nice,
but have a good feature set too. Not bad for $80 (cheapest one).

TTP

Psygnosis - Silent Running

2007-10-03, 10:14 pm

"Al Dykes" <adykes@panix.com> wrote in message
news:fe09jp$58n$1@panix5.panix.com...
> In article <5mhet3FdijlhU1@mid.individual.net>,
> Bigguy <bigguy36@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:
>
>
> I think I saw a a new line of Wacom pads with some under $100 in the
> store yesterday.
>
> A year+ ago, my friend did a quick evaluation of no-name graphic pads
> as part of a project and decided that Wacom was worth teh price for
> reasons from build-quality to the quality of the associated software.
>
> Now I see a bunch of cheap pads in the store and maybe it's time to
> have another evaluation.
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m
> Don't blame me. I voted for Gore. A Proud signature since 2001

Yes, the new Bamboo and Bamboo Fun line. They are quite nice for the money.

TTP

Burt Johnson

2007-10-03, 10:14 pm

Larry <invalid@invalid.com> wrote:

> Burt, try a few different sizes and see what you think.

Not sure how I would do that? They aren't available for testing
anywhere that I know of...

>That new Bamboo
> line might be just what you need. I couldn't find a larger one to try
> so I bought the Intuos. Btw, masking is just super with a tablet - SO
> much better than a mouse.

That is where I have mostly noticed it being used in video podcasts and
made think maybe I should try one.

I like the look of the Special Edition Intuos 6X11, but I keep telling
myself that should not be a prime deciding factor... :-)

> Another btw: I am told that if you use Photoshop (or Fireworks) on one
> monitor and something else (Dreamweaver in my case) on the other, you
> can limit the tablet to the Photoshop monitor, thereby doubling the
> effective resolution. I haven't done that yet, but one of these days
> I'm going to try it.

I would probably want to limit the tablet to one monitor, if possible.
I may have images up on both monitors, but I don't really span monitors
with a single image. I could easily see setting a limit for myself that
I must have the active image on a specific monitor.

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

Burt Johnson

2007-10-03, 10:14 pm

Psygnosis - Silent Running <Psygnosis@SilentRunning.com> wrote:

> Yes, the new Bamboo and Bamboo Fun line. They are quite nice for the money.

For me, $100 is pocket change. From the discussion here so far, I guess
I should buy a Bamboo (around $100) and give it a shot. I can always
upgrade later if I find I really like the tablet but feel cramped.

Thanks everyone for all the discussion on this!

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

tony cooper

2007-10-04, 3:14 am

On Wed, 03 Oct 2007 00:21:26 GMT, burt@mindstorm-inc.com (Burt
Johnson) wrote:

>I am not really an artist. Without a ruler, I can't come close to a
>straight line, and my portraits are stick figures. I know my way around
>Photoshop reasonably well in a purely technical way. That is, I have
>used it to create and edit user interface elements, and can modify
>photoographs at an advanced amateur level.
>
>I am tempted to get a Wacom tablet, to see where it can help.
>
>Question 1: Is a tablet even useful for someone like me?

I purchased a Wacom unit, practiced long and hard, and gave up in
despair. I use a roller ball, and can control it with very acceptable
precision.

I gave my Wacom to my daughter and it took her a day or so to become
very proficient with it. She has far less experience with Photoshop
than I do, but - evidently - has some sort of coordination that I
lack.

I can help you draw a straight line, though. Use the paint brush and
hold down the shift key as you move the mouse or roller ball.

>The $409 price tag is not out of reach, but I don't want to spend it
>only to later find I don't really use it...

I'm also a lousy golfer. Like many other lousy golfers, I feel that
my game will improve if I buy expensive new clubs. I have six
putters, four drivers, four sand wedges, and several hybrid clubs that
promised amazing results.

New stuff may not improve your game, but - damn! - wouldn't you feel
bad if it could and you didn't give it a chance?

--

Tony Cooper
Orlando, FL

tony cooper

2007-10-04, 3:14 am

On Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:52:30 -0400, tony cooper
<tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote:

>On Wed, 03 Oct 2007 00:21:26 GMT, burt@mindstorm-inc.com (Burt
>Johnson) wrote:
>
>
>I purchased a Wacom unit, practiced long and hard, and gave up in
>despair. I use a roller ball, and can control it with very acceptable
>precision.

Mind flatulence. "Trackball", not roller ball. I do have a roller
ball pen, but I can't get it to make the cursor move.

--

Tony Cooper
Orlando, FL

Burt Johnson

2007-10-04, 3:14 am

tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote:

> I'm also a lousy golfer. Like many other lousy golfers, I feel that
> my game will improve if I buy expensive new clubs. I have six
> putters, four drivers, four sand wedges, and several hybrid clubs that
> promised amazing results.

You sound like my wife! :-)

>
> New stuff may not improve your game, but - damn! - wouldn't you feel
> bad if it could and you didn't give it a chance?

Wow, you much be a shrink. You just figured me out, to a tee!

Based on feedback here, I'll probably forgo the pretty Special Edition
for $409 and just get a Bamboo for $100 to play with though. Even
though I will then not really know if that cool black color would have
improved my Photoshop just a bit more... and fix my slice at the same
time...

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

-Lost

2007-10-04, 6:14 am

Response from Larry <invalid@invalid.com>:

> the larger pads seem to let you handle things better,
> or at least easier. It is much easier to "draw" smoothly. I
> don't know how to express that properly, Mike, but I'd tell the OP
> to try different sizes first.

I just wanted to drop my 2 cents on that note too.

I have a smaller tablet and you have to adjust to the fact that
moving your stylus across several inches of a tablet equates to the
full dimension of your monitor.

With the larger tablets though you do not have to expect one inch of
tablet movement to be 4 to 6 inches on a monitor (or more). Instead
a huge tablet's movement is closer to actually moving across your
monitor at the same speed.

When I am getting deep into detail drawing something I wish I had a
larger tablet. As of now I have to draw REALLY slowly to get where I
am going sometimes. On a large tablet I could use faster more fluid
motions.

--
-Lost
Remove the extra words to reply by e-mail. Don't e-mail me. I am
kidding. No I am not.

-Lost

2007-10-04, 6:14 am

Response from burt@mindstorm-inc.com (Burt Johnson):

> tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>
> You sound like my wife! :-)
>
>
> Wow, you much be a shrink. You just figured me out, to a tee!
>
> Based on feedback here, I'll probably forgo the pretty Special
> Edition for $409 and just get a Bamboo for $100 to play with
> though. Even though I will then not really know if that cool
> black color would have improved my Photoshop just a bit more...
> and fix my slice at the same time...

To be perfectly honest and coming from a graphics, 3D/CG and CAD,
Flash, Photography and general designer and hobbyist, I would go with
both a small tablet for general work (anything) and a Cintiq for
large detailed pieces that I wanted to work on.

The Cintiq pays itself off quickly if you are in a related field.

Although I have never found working with a tablet useful in 3D per
se. On a Cintiq though it feels more natural because I can just lean
in and start working with an object in great detail.

So period, you will not go wrong with a small tablet. You might just
find out you want a larger one down the road is all. I don't think
it means your smaller one will lose its worth though.

--
-Lost
Remove the extra words to reply by e-mail. Don't e-mail me. I am
kidding. No I am not.

Psygnosis - Silent Running

2007-10-04, 10:14 pm

"Burt Johnson" <burt@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
news:1i5f5xc.o5j5m3b8bwr9N%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
> Psygnosis - Silent Running <Psygnosis@SilentRunning.com> wrote:
>
>
> For me, $100 is pocket change. From the discussion here so far, I guess
> I should buy a Bamboo (around $100) and give it a shot. I can always
> upgrade later if I find I really like the tablet but feel cramped.
>
> Thanks everyone for all the discussion on this!
>
> --
> - Burt Johnson
> MindStorm, Inc.
> http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

Just so you know the new Bamboo models are replacing the Graphire line.

Psygnosis

ronviers@gmail.com

2007-10-05, 6:14 am

On Oct 4, 5:01 am, "-Lost" <maventheextrawo...@techie.com> wrote:
> Response from b...@mindstorm-inc.com (Burt Johnson):
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To be perfectly honest and coming from a graphics, 3D/CG and CAD,
> Flash, Photography and general designer and hobbyist, I would go with
> both a small tablet for general work (anything) and a Cintiq for
> large detailed pieces that I wanted to work on.
>
> The Cintiq pays itself off quickly if you are in a related field.
>
> Although I have never found working with a tablet useful in 3D per
> se. On a Cintiq though it feels more natural because I can just lean
> in and start working with an object in great detail.
>
> So period, you will not go wrong with a small tablet. You might just
> find out you want a larger one down the road is all. I don't think
> it means your smaller one will lose its worth though.
>
> --
> -Lost
> Remove the extra words to reply by e-mail. Don't e-mail me. I am
> kidding. No I am not.

I was not aware of the Cintiqs until you mentioned them. Now I wish I
had one. They look awesome.

ggull

2007-10-06, 6:14 pm

"-Lost" <maventheextrawords@techie.com> wrote <snip>
> I have a smaller tablet and you have to adjust to the fact that
> moving your stylus across several inches of a tablet equates to the
> full dimension of your monitor.
>
> With the larger tablets though you do not have to expect one inch of
> tablet movement to be 4 to 6 inches on a monitor (or more). Instead
> a huge tablet's movement is closer to actually moving across your
> monitor at the same speed.

I'm a total tablet novice, but hypothetically interested, similar to OP.
So I have a really stupid question ...

Does the tablet have to map onto the whole monitor (let's not complicate it
with dual monitors :-)? or is it possible to use it as a window into a
smaller section of the monitor for detail work?
[Of course I guess you could always expand the image on the monitor.]

Psygnosis - Silent Running

2007-10-06, 6:14 pm

"ggull" <ggull.SPAM.BUST@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:K-ydnW3pWrM66ZranZ2dnUVZ_gGdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> "-Lost" <maventheextrawords@techie.com> wrote <snip>
>
> I'm a total tablet novice, but hypothetically interested, similar to OP.
> So I have a really stupid question ...
>
> Does the tablet have to map onto the whole monitor (let's not complicate
> it with dual monitors :-)? or is it possible to use it as a window into a
> smaller section of the monitor for detail work?
> [Of course I guess you could always expand the image on the monitor.]
>

With the higher end tablets you can map the work surface. I don't believe
this is possible with the Graphire or the new Bamboo tablets.

Personally, I have never had a problem with a 4x6 tablet and a 20" screen.
In fact my current system has two 19" and one 22" wide screen and still have
no issues.

Psygnosis

ggull

2007-10-07, 6:14 pm

"Psygnosis - Silent Running" <Psygnosis@SilentRunning.com> wrote >
> With the higher end tablets you can map the work surface. I don't believe
> this is possible with the Graphire or the new Bamboo tablets.
>
> Personally, I have never had a problem with a 4x6 tablet and a 20" screen.
> In fact my current system has two 19" and one 22" wide screen and still
> have no issues.

Thanks for the feedback. I'll fold it into my subconscious for when I
actually do something about this inchoate tablet lust :-). I guess it's
something you just have to try and see, in the end.

Psygnosis - Silent Running

2007-10-07, 6:14 pm

"ggull" <ggull.SPAM.BUST@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:gK6dnZ0tJq3IhJTanZ2dnUVZ_vqpnZ2d@comcast.com...
> "Psygnosis - Silent Running" <Psygnosis@SilentRunning.com> wrote >
>
> Thanks for the feedback. I'll fold it into my subconscious for when I
> actually do something about this inchoate tablet lust :-). I guess it's
> something you just have to try and see, in the end.
>

Amazon.com has some good deals on the Bamboo in their marketplace sellers. I
saw one there for almost half price. At about $50 you really can't go wrong.

Psygnosis

ggull

2007-10-07, 10:14 pm

"Psygnosis - Silent Running" <Psygnosis@SilentRunning.com> wrote t...
> "ggull"wrote
>
> Amazon.com has some good deals on the Bamboo in their marketplace sellers.
> I saw one there for almost half price. At about $50 you really can't go
> wrong.

Again, thanks for the hint. I just checked out the reviews and prices at
amazon and actually their price is virtually the same given the free
shipping. Hmm ... just might do this :-).

Burt Johnson

2007-10-07, 10:14 pm

Psygnosis - Silent Running <Psygnosis@SilentRunning.com> wrote:

> Amazon.com has some good deals on the Bamboo in their marketplace sellers. I
> saw one there for almost half price. At about $50 you really can't go wrong.

OK. Took the jump. The cheapest I found was $80, but I went ahead and
ordered one.

Way less than the $420 I was first thinking, and people here convinced
me not to go for the biggest one first. Will let you know what I think
of it after giving it a try!

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

leftwinger$as in hockey$

2007-10-08, 3:14 am

"Burt Johnson" <burt@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
news:1i5mj88.ygtdb4exr83pN%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
> Psygnosis - Silent Running <Psygnosis@SilentRunning.com> wrote:
>
>
> OK. Took the jump. The cheapest I found was $80, but I went ahead and
> ordered one.
>
> Way less than the $420 I was first thinking, and people here convinced
> me not to go for the biggest one first. Will let you know what I think
> of it after giving it a try!
>
> --
> - Burt Johnson
> MindStorm, Inc.
> http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

Is everyone basically saying that a Wacom Bamboo is sufficient to work with
Photoshop? And also a 20" widescreen? Thanks.

Dave

2007-10-08, 3:14 am

On Mon, 08 Oct 2007 00:30:35 GMT, burt@mindstorm-inc.com (Burt
Johnson) wrote:

>Way less than the $420 I was first thinking, and people here convinced
>me not to go for the biggest one first.

This does not sound very clever. Unless you delete the last word.
You should be any salesman's dream, buying double.

Dave

Burt Johnson

2007-10-08, 3:14 am

Dave <d@d.durbs> wrote:

> On Mon, 08 Oct 2007 00:30:35 GMT, burt@mindstorm-inc.com (Burt
> Johnson) wrote:
>
>
>
> This does not sound very clever. Unless you delete the last word.
> You should be any salesman's dream, buying double.

Whether I go for a larger one will depend a lot on my experience with
this one I just bought. Both in terms of how useful I find it, how
limiting I find the small size, and if I find it actually improves my
Photoshop work (given that I am a complete amateur and not an artist by
any stretch of imagination).

And yeah, I probably am a salesman's wet dream. I often buy stuff that
ends up unused. I bought both Aperture and Lightroom before deciding to
go with Lightroom. Back in the mid-90's when I decided to produce
videos (check out my web site to see the 52 we still sell), I spent
about $300K in equipment, and really ended up using about half (the
first half was "the wrong approach" in many respects, so I rebought
everything after learning what I had done wrong.)

Anything under $500 is an impulse purchase for me. Up to $1000 means I
have to think about it for a week first. :-)

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

Mike Russell

2007-10-08, 3:14 am

"Burt Johnson" <burt@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
news:1i5myrn.ll26oj1t5phu6N%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
> Dave <d@d.durbs> wrote:

Burt - Dave is just playing. Best to ignore.
--
Mike Russell - www.curvemeister.com

ronviers@gmail.com

2007-10-08, 3:14 am

On Oct 7, 10:17 pm, "leftwinger$as in hockey$"
<leftwin...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> "Burt Johnson" <b...@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message

> Is everyone basically saying that a Wacom Bamboo is sufficient to work with
> Photoshop? And also a 20" widescreen? Thanks.

Hi,
The Bamboo would not be suitable for me but the way I work may be very
unusual. I am right handed and I hold on to the tablet with my left
hand. There are buttons and a rubbing strip that I use with my left
thumb. So far I have not needed to change the buttons; cntl, alt,
shft, and space, but I reassign the rubbing strip and the pen buttons
according to the application that is open - for example, sometimes the
rubbing strip is left/right brackets, scroll or zoom and sometime the
upper pen button is middle mouse button while in other applications it
is double click. It feels more comfortable for me to kind-of hold the
tablet in front of me rather than have it lying on the desk so the
Bamboo would not be good. I use the Wacom Intuos 3. If you're left
handed they have them with the buttons either on both sides or they
can be configured to be turned upside down.

Good luck,
Ron

ronviers@gmail.com

2007-10-08, 3:14 am

On Oct 8, 1:09 am, b...@mindstorm-inc.com (Burt Johnson) wrote:
> Dave <d...@d.durbs> wrote:
>
>
>
> Whether I go for a larger one will depend a lot on my experience with
> this one I just bought. Both in terms of how useful I find it, how
> limiting I find the small size, and if I find it actually improves my
> Photoshop work (given that I am a complete amateur and not an artist by
> any stretch of imagination).
>
> And yeah, I probably am a salesman's wet dream. I often buy stuff that
> ends up unused. I bought both Aperture and Lightroom before deciding to
> go with Lightroom. Back in the mid-90's when I decided to produce
> videos (check out my web site to see the 52 we still sell), I spent
> about $300K in equipment, and really ended up using about half (the
> first half was "the wrong approach" in many respects, so I rebought
> everything after learning what I had done wrong.)
>
> Anything under $500 is an impulse purchase for me. Up to $1000 means I
> have to think about it for a week first. :-)
>
> --
> - Burt Johnson
> MindStorm, Inc.
> http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

Plus - if you really were a "salesman's wet dream" you would have went
with the Cintiq. In fact, with all those putters, I'm a little
surprised you didn't.

Good luck

ronviers@gmail.com

2007-10-08, 3:14 am

On Oct 7, 10:17 pm, "leftwinger$as in hockey$"
<leftwin...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> "Burt Johnson" <b...@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1i5mj88.ygtdb4exr83pN%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Is everyone basically saying that a Wacom Bamboo is sufficient to work with
> Photoshop? And also a 20" widescreen? Thanks.

I just wanted to add that you should not expect to like it right away.
Adapting to one, for me at least, was roughly equivalent to learning
to type.

Burt Johnson

2007-10-08, 6:14 am

ronviers@XXXXXXXXXX <ronviers@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:

> Plus - if you really were a "salesman's wet dream" you would have went
> with the Cintiq. In fact, with all those putters, I'm a little
> surprised you didn't.

I was ready to hop on the Special Edition tablet when I posted here. I
almost pushed the 'buy' button and decided I really had no idea about
this stuff, so asked here first.

In the next couple weeks, I will see if that was a good idea or not...
:-)

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

Andrew Morton

2007-10-08, 6:14 am

Hint: if you have a mug of coffee next to the pen holder, make sure you put
the pen in the holder, not the coffee, as one user here found out.

Andrew

Dave

2007-10-08, 6:14 pm

On Sun, 7 Oct 2007 23:27:14 -0700, "Mike Russell"
<RE-MOVEmike@Curvemeister.comRE-MOVE> wrote:

>"Burt Johnson" <burt@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
>news:1i5myrn.ll26oj1t5phu6N%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
>
>Burt - Dave is just playing. Best to ignore.

Not really Mike - this was more 'pity on my own pocket'.
I intend buying double because 'Wacom' was not available over here
when I needed a tablet, and I bought a 6X8 Genius, which is quite
nice.
But now Wacom is here and maybe maybe...:-)

Dave
http://dave.photos.gb.net/c1247464.html

-Lost

2007-10-10, 3:14 am

Response from burt@mindstorm-inc.com (Burt Johnson):

> ronviers@XXXXXXXXXX <ronviers@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:
>
>
> I was ready to hop on the Special Edition tablet when I posted
> here. I almost pushed the 'buy' button and decided I really had no
> idea about this stuff, so asked here first.
>
> In the next couple weeks, I will see if that was a good idea or
> not...

OK, after reviewing your site it seems to me that you were in a
position to get whatever you wanted. So I will rephrase my previous
advice.

1. If you plan on doing something worthwhile with graphics,
photography, animation, anything artistic that requires precision
hand movement or drawing, then I would go with the biggest and the
baddest ALTHOUGH the smallest works JUST FINE.

2. I said this previously, BUT I will say it again. If I had the
money or rather... if my work depended on it more so, I would have
BOTH. A small one and a Cintiq (only for the ability to draw
directly on the screen and see it in all its large grand glory).

Do let us know how you like the small one though.

--
-Lost
Remove the extra words to reply by e-mail. Don't e-mail me. I am
kidding. No I am not.

Burt Johnson

2007-10-10, 3:14 am

-Lost <maventheextrawords@techie.com> wrote:

> 1. If you plan on doing something worthwhile with graphics,
> photography, animation, anything artistic that requires precision
> hand movement or drawing, then I would go with the biggest and the
> baddest ALTHOUGH the smallest works JUST FINE.

I will just be dinking with photographs initially. Basically relearning
photography after a 30 year hiatus, and seeing how Photoshop replaced my
hotshot darkroom of the 70's.

I have touched up photos occasionally for use in documentary videos, and
fixed some Board of Directory photos my wife did, but not much more. The
rest of my Photoshop has been more technical -- creating buttons and
user interface elements for software I have developed.

>
> 2. I said this previously, BUT I will say it again. If I had the
> money or rather... if my work depended on it more so, I would have
> BOTH. A small one and a Cintiq (only for the ability to draw
> directly on the screen and see it in all its large grand glory).

As such, I can not really say I am doing anything serious. If I end up
liking it, and discover some latent talent, I will have no qualms about
buying the biggest, baddest tablet I can find. :-)

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

akphotog

2007-10-10, 10:14 pm

FWIW...I tried and tried to get comfortable with a tablet and always felt
like more time consuming than anything else. But, I am not an illustrator.
But, I never learned how to put contact in either so it's probably just me.
:)

"Burt Johnson" <burt@mindstorm-inc.com> wrote in message
news:1i5qnjp.1531qx95scpo2N%burt@mindstorm-inc.com...
> -Lost <maventheextrawords@techie.com> wrote:
>
>
> I will just be dinking with photographs initially. Basically relearning
> photography after a 30 year hiatus, and seeing how Photoshop replaced my
> hotshot darkroom of the 70's.
>
> I have touched up photos occasionally for use in documentary videos, and
> fixed some Board of Directory photos my wife did, but not much more. The
> rest of my Photoshop has been more technical -- creating buttons and
> user interface elements for software I have developed.
>
>
> As such, I can not really say I am doing anything serious. If I end up
> liking it, and discover some latent talent, I will have no qualms about
> buying the biggest, baddest tablet I can find. :-)
>
>
> --
> - Burt Johnson
> MindStorm, Inc.
> http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html

Scubabix

2007-10-13, 6:14 pm

"Bigguy" <bigguy36@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote in message
news:5mhet3FdijlhU1@mid.individual.net...[color=darkred]
> Burt Johnson wrote:

If you're looking into darkroom type functions, check into Lightroom. It's
a spin-off of PS and works great if all you're doing is processing photos.
The workflow is much simpler than PS without needing the artistic skills. A
5D is definitely a way to "delve more seriously" into digital photography.

Rob

Burt Johnson

2007-10-15, 3:14 am

Scubabix <Scubabix@comcast.net> wrote:

> If you're looking into darkroom type functions, check into Lightroom. It's
> a spin-off of PS and works great if all you're doing is processing photos.
> The workflow is much simpler than PS without needing the artistic skills. A
> 5D is definitely a way to "delve more seriously" into digital photography.

Yes, I already have that. I tied Bridge, iView Media Pro, Aperture and
Lightroom, and settled on Lightroom about a month ago. Still getting
used to it, but overall I like it better than the others.

--
- Burt Johnson
MindStorm, Inc.
http://www.mindstorm-inc.com/software.html