Computer Graphics with Photoshop - Saving a selection shape and recalling it

Author

Saving a selection shape and recalling it

Desert Rat

2006-09-05, 6:17 pm

Recently immigrated from Paint Shop Pro X to PS CS2. In PSP X I could
make a selection shape on an image using the Selection Tool, say a
rectangle for cropping, then save that selection shape and dimensions
to a library. I could then open another image, load the saved selection
from the library and perform the function I wanted.

In CS2 I'm having trouble duplicating this. I'll open an image, create
my selection and choose Select>Save selection. I'm then offered the
option to save the selection as the existing document name or a new
document. I've tried saving the selection both as a .psd file or as the
existing document. I'll then open an image and try Select>Load
selection but since the opened image is a "background" and locked this
option is not available. If I duplicate the layer the Select>Load
selection is available but when I try and call up the selection I saved
there is no option to load it. I have been able to do it by leaving the
original image open, opening a new image and then dragging the channel
which contains the selection from the old image to the new image. I
then have to use the magic wand to select the unwanted "masked
area"(?), invert it and then my selection is then visible BUT not
exactly the same.

Obviously there is a simple way to do this but I have done a pretty
extensive search in both CS2 newsgroups and in CS2 tutorials and can't
seem to find a solution. As stated in the beginning this was a 5 second
process in PSP X so I hope I'm missing really basic in duplicating this
in CS2.

As steep as the learning curve is in CS2 I'm extremely happy with it!
Thankfully, the basics of layering, masking and a lot of other
functions are similar enough to PSP X or I fear I might never master
it. Let me modify that...not master but become nominally proficient at
using it :-)

TIA for any suggestions

Harry Limey

2006-09-05, 6:17 pm

"Desert Rat" <desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote in message
news:1157474893.685469.112590@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
> Recently immigrated from Paint Shop Pro X to PS CS2. In PSP X I could

I just tried this by opening an image, making a selection, saving the
selection - gave the selection a name, saved and closed the file, then
opened a new file and the old one at the same time, when I went to the
selection menu in the new image, it gave me the option of opening the
selection from the old image!!

Aaron

2006-09-05, 6:17 pm

Desert Rat wrote:
> Recently immigrated from Paint Shop Pro X to PS CS2. In PSP X I could
> make a selection shape on an image using the Selection Tool, say a
> rectangle for cropping, then save that selection shape and dimensions
> to a library. I could then open another image, load the saved selection
> from the library and perform the function I wanted.
>
> In CS2 I'm having trouble duplicating this. I'll open an image, create
> my selection and choose Select>Save selection. I'm then offered the
> option to save the selection as the existing document name or a new
> document. I've tried saving the selection both as a .psd file or as the
> existing document. I'll then open an image and try Select>Load
> selection but since the opened image is a "background" and locked this
> option is not available. If I duplicate the layer the Select>Load
> selection is available but when I try and call up the selection I saved
> there is no option to load it. I have been able to do it by leaving the
> original image open, opening a new image and then dragging the channel
> which contains the selection from the old image to the new image. I
> then have to use the magic wand to select the unwanted "masked
> area"(?), invert it and then my selection is then visible BUT not
> exactly the same.
>
> Obviously there is a simple way to do this but I have done a pretty
> extensive search in both CS2 newsgroups and in CS2 tutorials and can't
> seem to find a solution. As stated in the beginning this was a 5 second
> process in PSP X so I hope I'm missing really basic in duplicating this
> in CS2.
>
> As steep as the learning curve is in CS2 I'm extremely happy with it!
> Thankfully, the basics of layering, masking and a lot of other
> functions are similar enough to PSP X or I fear I might never master
> it. Let me modify that...not master but become nominally proficient at
> using it :-)
>
> TIA for any suggestions
>

First of all, saving the selection uses channels, so you need to save
the file in a format that supports channels. PSD is one, TIFF is
another. I would recommend saving everything as a PSD just because you
know you'll get all the features available.

As for using a selection created in one image in a second image, that's
a little bit different. Photoshop doesn't have a "library" of selections
independent from the files they were created in. So, in order to get a
selection from one document to another, you DO have to either drag the
selection or drag the channel from the source document to the
destination document.

Spend some time experimenting and I'm sure you'll find the best way to
do what you need to do.

--
Aaron

"Mankind are greater gainers by suffering each other to live as seems
good to themselves, than by compelling each to live as seems good to the
rest." -- John Stuart Mill

tembo@gotadsl.co.uk

2006-09-05, 6:17 pm

>
>
> As for using a selection created in one image in a second image, that's
> a little bit different. Photoshop doesn't have a "library" of selections
> independent from the files they were created in. So, in order to get a
> selection from one document to another, you DO have to either drag the
> selection or drag the channel from the source document to the
> destination document.
>
Or when you have a selection already highlighted in your document,
select "Select" on the menu, then save selection. You can give it a
name. You can do this for many different selections and all this does
is create named channels, which you could equally have done manually as
well.

Then from within the other document select "Select" then load selection
whilst both docs are open and you can choose which previously saved
selection (channel) you want to load from any of your other opened docs.

I found dragging to be a bit hit and miss between docs.

Desert Rat

2006-09-05, 6:17 pm

Aaron wrote:
> Desert Rat wrote:
>
> First of all, saving the selection uses channels, so you need to save
> the file in a format that supports channels. PSD is one, TIFF is
> another. I would recommend saving everything as a PSD just because you
> know you'll get all the features available.
>
> As for using a selection created in one image in a second image, that's
> a little bit different. Photoshop doesn't have a "library" of selections
> independent from the files they were created in. So, in order to get a
> selection from one document to another, you DO have to either drag the
> selection or drag the channel from the source document to the
> destination document.
>
> Spend some time experimenting and I'm sure you'll find the best way to
> do what you need to do.
>
> --
> Aaron
>
> "Mankind are greater gainers by suffering each other to live as seems
> good to themselves, than by compelling each to live as seems good to the
> rest." -- John Stuart Mill

Thanks for the info Aaron. I'm working with scanned TIFF images
(restoring old 2 1/4" square photos). Your suggestion of dragging the
selection from one image to another seems to work the best for my
purpose which is to create a standard cropping selection. I overscan
the images to include partial borders so I want to create a selection I
can apply to all. I found that if I created the selection as a channel
I would then have to still modify it to get it to the selection size
after dragging it to the new image. Shame there's no way to library
selections but the workarounds are easy to remember and will work as
well even if it takes a bit longer to get there.

Desert Rat

2006-09-05, 6:17 pm

tembo@gotadsl.co.uk wrote:
> Or when you have a selection already highlighted in your document,
> select "Select" on the menu, then save selection. You can give it a
> name. You can do this for many different selections and all this does
> is create named channels, which you could equally have done manually as
> well.
>
> Then from within the other document select "Select" then load selection
> whilst both docs are open and you can choose which previously saved
> selection (channel) you want to load from any of your other opened docs.
>
> I found dragging to be a bit hit and miss between docs.

Sorry but that didn't work for me. When I name the document and save it
it still doesn't show up when I open a new document. In addition, the
option to "Load Selection" is not available on a newly opened image
which is just the background image. The option to Load Selection is not
available. Once I change the background layer (by duplicating or
renaming it) then the Load selection is available but the only option
is for the existing document. I cannot access any saved channels or
..psd images from the drop down menu in the Source>Document box.

Hunt

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

In article <1157492604.704592.57400@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>,
desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX says...
>
>Aaron wrote:
[color=darkred]
>
>Thanks for the info Aaron. I'm working with scanned TIFF images
>(restoring old 2 1/4" square photos). Your suggestion of dragging the
>selection from one image to another seems to work the best for my
>purpose which is to create a standard cropping selection. I overscan
>the images to include partial borders so I want to create a selection I
>can apply to all. I found that if I created the selection as a channel
>I would then have to still modify it to get it to the selection size
>after dragging it to the new image. Shame there's no way to library
>selections but the workarounds are easy to remember and will work as
>well even if it takes a bit longer to get there.

One thing that you might want to think about doing, is setting up a blank
image (Image>New, or Ctrl-n) with the size/rez, that you will be scanning. In
blank imgage, make a Selection of the desired size, Save Selection [name
here] and then Save that image - TIF would be fine. It will basically be a
blank Background (italicized) and the single Alpha Channel. All you will need
to do is Open this newly created image and use that Selection from it. If you
have set up the image with regards to Mode, Size, etc. it will be very close.
This is basically what the FX Photo Edges are - Alpha Channels, saved as TIFF.

If you find yourself working with different resolutions, or image sizes, you
can re-size your image (one w/ Alpha Channel) to meet your needs, but you'll
probably find that if you are doing the scanning, everything will conform to
one, or maybe two, sizes. If that's the case, Save_As [different name here]
for the other size(s). I'd choose a naming convention with the image size/rez
in the name.

Hunt

Desert Rat

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

Hunt wrote:
> In article <1157492604.704592.57400@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>,
> desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX says...
>
>
> One thing that you might want to think about doing, is setting up a blank
> image (Image>New, or Ctrl-n) with the size/rez, that you will be scanning. In
> blank imgage, make a Selection of the desired size, Save Selection [name
> here] and then Save that image - TIF would be fine. It will basically be a
> blank Background (italicized) and the single Alpha Channel. All you will need
> to do is Open this newly created image and use that Selection from it. If you
> have set up the image with regards to Mode, Size, etc. it will be very close.
> This is basically what the FX Photo Edges are - Alpha Channels, saved as TIFF.
>
> If you find yourself working with different resolutions, or image sizes, you
> can re-size your image (one w/ Alpha Channel) to meet your needs, but you'll
> probably find that if you are doing the scanning, everything will conform to
> one, or maybe two, sizes. If that's the case, Save_As [different name here]
> for the other size(s). I'd choose a naming convention with the image size/rez
> in the name.
>
> Hunt

I tried your suggestion but the problem is that whenever I open the new
image (one that I have already scanned) I cannot access the Load
Selection option under Select. Even if I change the Background layer to
Layer 0 or just duplicate the existing background layer and am able to
access the Select>Load selection option there is no option for me to
open the saved selection from the image file I saved per your
instructions. The only option available in the Load Selection window
under Document box>Source is the existing file name. No option to open
the selection I saved as i.e. "Crop 1".

I'm obviously doing something very wrong because every response here
seems to indicate that I should be able to open a saved selection from
the Load Selection window but this is what I'm seeing. This is starting
to be very frustating as I really could just open a scanned image and
then apply a new selection and then crop it but I don't always get the
exact same selection dimensions. The ability to have a fixed selection
size would be of great benifit considering I have somewhere around 3000
images to process.

Peter Wollenberg

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

"Desert Rat" <desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:

>Hunt wrote:
....[color=darkred]
>
>I tried your suggestion but the problem is that whenever I open the new
>image (one that I have already scanned) I cannot access the Load
>Selection option under Select. Even if I change the Background layer to
>Layer 0 or just duplicate the existing background layer and am able to
>access the Select>Load selection option there is no option for me to
>open the saved selection from the image file I saved per your
>instructions. The only option available in the Load Selection window
>under Document box>Source is the existing file name. No option to open
>the selection I saved as i.e. "Crop 1".
>
....

The document which contains the selection must:

1. be open in PS
2. have the same size as the document, to which you want to apply the
selection.
3. The layer, to which the selection is to be applied, must not be the
background layer (double click on the layer then ENTER to change it to
a normal layer.

If theses criteria are met, you will be able to load a selection from
a different document

But as I understand, you want to apply a rectangular selection. Why
not set the rectangular selecton tool of PS to a fixed size or aspect
ratio. This should work fine. And read the online help about the
intricacies of the crop tool (e.g. "front image"). This might be an
option as well.

Peter

Hunt

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

In article <1157502297.085294.307920@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX says...
>
>Hunt wrote:
In[color=darkred]
need[color=darkred]
you[color=darkred]
close.[color=darkred]
TIFF.[color=darkred]
you[color=darkred]
you'll[color=darkred]
to[color=darkred]
rez[color=darkred]
>
>I tried your suggestion but the problem is that whenever I open the new
>image (one that I have already scanned) I cannot access the Load
>Selection option under Select. Even if I change the Background layer to
>Layer 0 or just duplicate the existing background layer and am able to
>access the Select>Load selection option there is no option for me to
>open the saved selection from the image file I saved per your
>instructions. The only option available in the Load Selection window
>under Document box>Source is the existing file name. No option to open
>the selection I saved as i.e. "Crop 1".

Sorry, but I wasn't clear on that - my bad. Since PS doesn't create a Library
of Selections as some programs, Painter for one, you have to have both
documents Open. When usuing the Saved Alpha Channels, I just open it first,
then my images, whether scanned, created via digital capture, or created from
scratch. Since you are scanning (I assume that you are scanning, though that's
not important, so long as the specs. for the scan are the same), you can set
the size to a constant, then just drag the Alpha Channel, or, if that image is
Open, Load Selection>Document (drop-down). It should come in at the correct
size/rez to be the same with all of your images.
>
>I'm obviously doing something very wrong because every response here
>seems to indicate that I should be able to open a saved selection from
>the Load Selection window but this is what I'm seeing. This is starting
>to be very frustating as I really could just open a scanned image and
>then apply a new selection and then crop it but I don't always get the
>exact same selection dimensions. The ability to have a fixed selection
>size would be of great benifit considering I have somewhere around 3000
>images to process.

Don't get frustrated yet. You are on the threshold of the solution. You just
need to have the images w/ the Alpha Channel Open, that's all.

Please let me know if this helps and works.

Hunt

Desert Rat

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

Peter Wollenberg wrote:

<snip>

> But as I understand, you want to apply a rectangular selection. Why
> not set the rectangular selecton tool of PS to a fixed size or aspect
> ratio. This should work fine. And read the online help about the
> intricacies of the crop tool (e.g. "front image"). This might be an
> option as well.
>
> Peter

Thanks Peter. The fixed size selection tool setting works great! Such a
simple solution but it totally eluded me. Many thanks to everyone who
responded for their help and suggestions.

A grateful newbie

theartist

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

Desert Rat wrote:
> Recently immigrated from Paint Shop Pro X to PS CS2. In PSP X I could
> make a selection shape on an image using the Selection Tool, say a
> rectangle for cropping, then save that selection shape and dimensions
> to a library. I could then open another image, load the saved selection
> from the library and perform the function I wanted.
>
> In CS2 I'm having trouble duplicating this. I'll open an image, create
> my selection and choose Select>Save selection. I'm then offered the
> option to save the selection as the existing document name or a new
> document. I've tried saving the selection both as a .psd file or as the
> existing document. I'll then open an image and try Select>Load
> selection but since the opened image is a "background" and locked this
> option is not available. If I duplicate the layer the Select>Load
> selection is available but when I try and call up the selection I saved
> there is no option to load it. I have been able to do it by leaving the
> original image open, opening a new image and then dragging the channel
> which contains the selection from the old image to the new image. I
> then have to use the magic wand to select the unwanted "masked
> area"(?), invert it and then my selection is then visible BUT not
> exactly the same.
>
> Obviously there is a simple way to do this but I have done a pretty
> extensive search in both CS2 newsgroups and in CS2 tutorials and can't
> seem to find a solution. As stated in the beginning this was a 5 second
> process in PSP X so I hope I'm missing really basic in duplicating this
> in CS2.
>
> As steep as the learning curve is in CS2 I'm extremely happy with it!
> Thankfully, the basics of layering, masking and a lot of other
> functions are similar enough to PSP X or I fear I might never master
> it. Let me modify that...not master but become nominally proficient at
> using it :-)
>
> TIA for any suggestions
>
>
You can also turn the selection into a path, which you can use on a
shape layer. Those you CAN save for later. Just load the shape you want
from the library.

--
§¦: } theartist
Do the math ... count your blessings.

Paul Mitchum

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

Desert Rat <desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:

> Recently immigrated from Paint Shop Pro X to PS CS2. In PSP X I could
> make a selection shape on an image using the Selection Tool, say a
> rectangle for cropping, then save that selection shape and dimensions
> to a library. I could then open another image, load the saved selection
> from the library and perform the function I wanted.

Here's the ultra-short version:

Open an image and ake a selection. Press Q. The selected parts will turn
red. Do a Select All and then a Copy.

Go to the other image. Press Q. Paste. Press Q again. You're done.

'Q' is for Quickmask. Red shows you what's selected. While you're in
quickmask mode, you can paint the selection.

If you want to save a selection, you should follow the above directions,
but when you've got the selection on the clipboard (just after Copying
it), make a new document (File -> New). Make sure 'Clipboard' is
selected under 'Preset:' in the dialog, and then click 'OK.' Paste the
selection into the new document. Save it.

To load it back up, just open that document, Select All, then Copy. Now
you can paste it back into whatever quickmask you wish.

HTH.

Aaron

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

Paul Mitchum wrote:
> Desert Rat <desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:
>
>
> Here's the ultra-short version:
>
> Open an image and ake a selection. Press Q. The selected parts will turn
> red. Do a Select All and then a Copy.
>
> Go to the other image. Press Q. Paste. Press Q again. You're done.
>
> 'Q' is for Quickmask. Red shows you what's selected. While you're in
> quickmask mode, you can paint the selection.
>
>
> If you want to save a selection, you should follow the above directions,
> but when you've got the selection on the clipboard (just after Copying
> it), make a new document (File -> New). Make sure 'Clipboard' is
> selected under 'Preset:' in the dialog, and then click 'OK.' Paste the
> selection into the new document. Save it.
>
> To load it back up, just open that document, Select All, then Copy. Now
> you can paste it back into whatever quickmask you wish.
>
> HTH.

That is far and away the best tip I've read this month. I reserve the
right to declare a better tip before the month is out but HOT DAMN
that's a handy trick. I didn't know that copying the quick mask view
would copy the mask shape... There are so many things I can do with this
technique.

Cheers!

--
Aaron

"Mankind are greater gainers by suffering each other to live as seems
good to themselves, than by compelling each to live as seems good to the
rest." -- John Stuart Mill

Hunt

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

In article <ZbidnYPncasxhJ3YnZ2dnUVZ_oednZ2d@giganews.com>,
aaron@thebailiwick.com says...
>
>Paul Mitchum wrote:
>
>That is far and away the best tip I've read this month. I reserve the
>right to declare a better tip before the month is out but HOT DAMN
>that's a handy trick. I didn't know that copying the quick mask view
>would copy the mask shape... There are so many things I can do with this
>technique.
>
>Cheers!
>
>--
>Aaron

Isn't it amazing how many ways one can do something in PS? Hardly a day goes
by, that there isn't some useful tip from this NG.

Hunt

Paul Mitchum

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

Aaron <aaron@thebailiwick.com> wrote:

> Paul Mitchum wrote:
>
> That is far and away the best tip I've read this month. I reserve the
> right to declare a better tip before the month is out but HOT DAMN
> that's a handy trick. I didn't know that copying the quick mask view
> would copy the mask shape... There are so many things I can do with this
> technique.

It's just the same as saving the selection to a channel and then
copying/pasting the channel. Except you only have to press 'Q.' :-)

In fact, if you have the channel palette open while doing this, you'll
see a 'Quickmask' channel appear, and then disappear when you leave
quickmask mode.

John Forest

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

It sounds like you are really only cropping the image to a set final
rectangular size. If that's the case, the easy way is to use the crop tool.
You can set the image size and the resolution, for example 5 X 7 inches at
300 pixels per inch and then just drag the tool from one corner of the image
to the other to include the area you want. Once you have it approximately
right you can modify the selection, rotate it, etc. Just hit the enter key
to perform the selection. You can save the selection you want as a preset,
and there is a handy set of arrows to click to change it from horizontal to
vertical or vice versa.

Desert Rat

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

Paul Mitchum wrote:
> Desert Rat <desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:
>
>
> Here's the ultra-short version:
>
> Open an image and ake a selection. Press Q. The selected parts will turn
> red. Do a Select All and then a Copy.
>
> Go to the other image. Press Q. Paste. Press Q again. You're done.
>
> 'Q' is for Quickmask. Red shows you what's selected. While you're in
> quickmask mode, you can paint the selection.
>
>
> If you want to save a selection, you should follow the above directions,
> but when you've got the selection on the clipboard (just after Copying
> it), make a new document (File -> New). Make sure 'Clipboard' is
> selected under 'Preset:' in the dialog, and then click 'OK.' Paste the
> selection into the new document. Save it.
>
> To load it back up, just open that document, Select All, then Copy. Now
> you can paste it back into whatever quickmask you wish.
>
> HTH.

Paul, that is a very cool tip. I still have to select the "red" area,
do a Select>Inverse and then I can crop to the inside selection (which
is the area I want). Is this correct or is there a way to crop without
the above steps?

Paul Mitchum

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

Desert Rat <desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:

> Paul Mitchum wrote:
>
> Paul, that is a very cool tip. I still have to select the "red" area,
> do a Select>Inverse and then I can crop to the inside selection (which
> is the area I want). Is this correct or is there a way to crop without
> the above steps?

Here's a question for you: Do you think Photoshop will crop out the
*middle* of the image?

Desert Rat

2006-09-08, 6:17 pm

Paul Mitchum wrote:
> Desert Rat <desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:
>
>
> Here's a question for you: Do you think Photoshop will crop out the
> *middle* of the image?

Excuse me for being a bit dense but after I paste my copied Quick Mask
over the new image I have the "middle" which is the area I want to
retain in a crop and the outside "red" area. I have to select (magic
wand) the red area and do a Select>Inverse to give me a selection area
inside the red. Is this correct or am I missing something?

Paul Mitchum

2006-09-12, 10:17 pm

Desert Rat <desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:

> Paul Mitchum wrote:
>
> Excuse me for being a bit dense but after I paste my copied Quick Mask
> over the new image I have the "middle" which is the area I want to retain
> in a crop and the outside "red" area. I have to select (magic wand) the
> red area and do a Select>Inverse to give me a selection area inside the
> red. Is this correct or am I missing something?

Paste in the quickmask. Then hit Q.

--
In retrospect, the real victims of Fox News weren't the liberals it
attacked but the conservatives who believed it. -- NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

Desert Rat

2006-09-12, 10:17 pm

Paul Mitchum wrote:
> Desert Rat <desertryder@XXXXXXXXXX> wrote:
>
>
> Paste in the quickmask. Then hit Q.
>
> --
> In retrospect, the real victims of Fox News weren't the liberals it
> attacked but the conservatives who believed it. -- NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

OK, I got it! Thanks for the info.