Computer Graphics with Photoshop - Why is CS2 darkening my images when I open them?

Author

Why is CS2 darkening my images when I open them?

Doug Warner

2006-07-10, 6:18 pm

http://webpages.charter.net/dwarner2/LightDarkPS.jpg

The above is a Canon 10D shot, with Adobe RGB profile. The left side
is the original image, The right is after I opened it in CS2, then
saved it. As soon as it opens, it displays much darker than the
original, making marginally dark images unrecoverable. =20

If I save one, then re-open it, it does not darken it again,. so it
seems to do this only with original images from the camera. =20

It also does it with older ones as well. This problem has only
recently appeared. =20

Any ideas on why CS is modifying these images on it's own?
--
Email reply: please remove one letter from each side of "@"
Spammers are Scammers. Exterminate them.

Roy G

2006-07-10, 6:18 pm

"Doug Warner" <dwarner22@ccharter.net> wrote in message
news:19pfa290iabdh6rdq02ri841e2lk17rftr@4ax.com...
http://webpages.charter.net/dwarner2/LightDarkPS.jpg

The above is a Canon 10D shot, with Adobe RGB profile. The left side
is the original image, The right is after I opened it in CS2, then
saved it. As soon as it opens, it displays much darker than the
original, making marginally dark images unrecoverable.

If I save one, then re-open it, it does not darken it again,. so it
seems to do this only with original images from the camera.

It also does it with older ones as well. This problem has only
recently appeared.

Any ideas on why CS is modifying these images on it's own?
--
Email reply: please remove one letter from each side of "@"
Spammers are Scammers. Exterminate them.

Hi.

When you say the Left one is the original, I assume it has been downloaded
from the camera, then viewed and saved in some program other than PS.

The Right one has just been downloaded to the computer then opened and saved
in PS, or was it also viewed or saved in that other program first.

Without knowing the exact sequence of events, it seems most likely that the
difference in density may be due to Colour Management being applied by PS.

Most other programs do not use C.M. Indeed some, like my copy of Irfanview,
actually remove Tagged Profiles.

It might well be worthwhile checking what Colour Settings are selected in
PS, including the Working Space Profile and the Profile being used for the
Monitor.

Roy G

Doug Warner

2006-07-10, 6:18 pm

"Roy G" <roy.gibson1@REMOVE.tesco.net> wrote:

>When you say the Left one is the original, I assume it has been =
downloaded=20
>from the camera, then viewed and saved in some program other than PS.
>
>The Right one has just been downloaded to the computer then opened and =
saved=20
>in PS, or was it also viewed or saved in that other program first.
>
>Without knowing the exact sequence of events, it seems most likely that=
the=20
>difference in density may be due to Colour Management being applied by =
PS.
>
The original and saved one are both being displayed in separate
windows by ThumbsPlus. I just overlapped the windows, did an
alt-print screen clipboard capture.
I pasted the clipboard into PS. (No darkening) and cropped out the
sample image I posted. =20
The blue divider is the edge of the overlapping window.

Ignore EXIF is unchecked.

If I open an image in MSPaint, it's also lighter than the one opened
in CS2.

Also, if I set the camera to produce sRGB profiled images, the CS
doesn't darken them upon loading, but instead, sRGB images get their=20
saturation insreased. =20

This problem doesn;t happen on my laptop. =20

Given the number of things screwed up with this system, I think it's
time for a reload, and perhaps, upgrade this old 2.4Ghz box while I'm
at it. =20

>Most other programs do not use C.M. Indeed some, like my copy of =
Irfanview,=20
>actually remove Tagged Profiles.
>
>It might well be worthwhile checking what Colour Settings are selected =
in=20
>PS, including the Working Space Profile and the Profile being used for =
the=20
>Monitor.
>
>Roy G=20
>

--
Email reply: please remove one letter from each side of "@"
Spammers are Scammers. Exterminate them.

Roy G

2006-07-10, 6:18 pm

"Doug Warner" <dwarner22@ccharter.net> wrote in message
news:mkaga2leifil34vgmgn04dos2jusg6bn82@4ax.com...
"Roy G" <roy.gibson1@REMOVE.tesco.net> wrote:

Hi.

It is Photoshop Colour Management which is doing this, for certain.

It must be "Converting" to a profile at opening, but to which. Have you got
it set to "ask before converting" in Colour Settings.

Do you have anything turned on in View > Proof Colours.

Roy G

Doug Warner

2006-07-10, 6:18 pm

"Roy G" <roy.gibson1@REMOVE.tesco.net> wrote:

>Hi.
>
>It is Photoshop Colour Management which is doing this, for certain.
>
>It must be "Converting" to a profile at opening, but to which. Have you=
got=20
>it set to "ask before converting" in Colour Settings.
>
>Do you have anything turned on in View > Proof Colours.
>
>Roy G=20
>

Proof colors is off, and it's set to convert to working RGB, which is
Adobe RGB.=20
It used to ask if I opened a sRGB file, but it doesn't do that any
more,

I tried changing the color settings to something else and back again,
but it still doesn;'t ask. =20
I then copied the settings folder from a backup to the loacation in
the Documents and Settins tree. Now it asks again when opening sRGB
files, but it still darkens Adobe RGB files from the 10D. =20

--
Email reply: please remove one letter from each side of "@"
Spammers are Scammers. Exterminate them.

Johan W. Elzenga

2006-07-10, 6:18 pm

Doug Warner <dwarner22@ccharter.net> wrote:

> Proof colors is off, and it's set to convert to working RGB, which is
> Adobe RGB.
> It used to ask if I opened a sRGB file, but it doesn't do that any
> more,
>
> I tried changing the color settings to something else and back again,
> but it still doesn;'t ask.
> I then copied the settings folder from a backup to the loacation in
> the Documents and Settins tree. Now it asks again when opening sRGB
> files, but it still darkens Adobe RGB files from the 10D.

Try turning 'Ignore EXIF profile tag' in the general preferences ON. I
believe that some cameras actually write the wrong color profile tag in
the EXIF headers, so Photoshop should ignore that information.

--
Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl
Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl

Roy G

2006-07-10, 6:18 pm

"Doug Warner" <dwarner22@ccharter.net> wrote in message
news:19pfa290iabdh6rdq02ri841e2lk17rftr@4ax.com...
http://webpages.charter.net/dwarner2/LightDarkPS.jpg

The above is a Canon 10D shot, with Adobe RGB profile. The left side
is the original image, The right is after I opened it in CS2, then
saved it. As soon as it opens, it displays much darker than the
original, making marginally dark images unrecoverable.

If I save one, then re-open it, it does not darken it again,. so it
seems to do this only with original images from the camera.

It also does it with older ones as well. This problem has only
recently appeared.

Any ideas on why CS is modifying these images on it's own?
--
Email reply: please remove one letter from each side of "@"
Spammers are Scammers. Exterminate them.

Hi again.

For instructions on how to set up PS, Colour Settings, (and also how to
Print using ICC Profiles), have a look at www.ayrphoto.co.uk go to Info
Pages and How to Print for accurate Colour.

The first section is about setting up Photoshop. There are also articles on
how to do this correctly on www.computer-darkroom.com those can be just a
bit too technical, and require a bit of studying, but they are very
comprehensive, and give all the reasons why.

The Ayr Photo one is designed by and for an idiot, me.

The Camera Club site also has an article on how to set up Soft Proof.

It has just ocurred to me that the darker version you are getting in PS
could actually be the accurate one, and the lighter version in other
Programs is actually incorrect, because those other programs do not use
Colour Management, and therefore can not read your tagged on Adobe RGB
Profile, and will be treating yoiur image as if it was an sRGB one.

Roy G

Doug Warner

2006-07-10, 6:18 pm

nomail@please.invalid (Johan W. Elzenga) wrote:

>
>Try turning 'Ignore EXIF profile tag' in the general preferences ON. I
>believe that some cameras actually write the wrong color profile tag in
>the EXIF headers, so Photoshop should ignore that information.

Tried that earlier, and again just now. No difference. =20
Also, the same issue occurs if I open the image from Photoshop,
instead of through ThumbsPlus. =20

Still, this may be related to a ThumbsPlus issue that popped up at
around the same time. If I make any change to an image using TP, then
try to save it. I get a pop-up from TP that says:

"[5719/5] test1.JPG: Unable to convert image data from '(Unknown)' to
sRGB IEC61966-2.1': Access is denied" =20
If I click "OK", it saves it anyway. =20

This may indicate a global problem.. =20

And, when I view a 10D image's properties with XP, the "Color
Representation" field says "Uncalibrated" It does this on my main
system as well as the laptop, (Which doesn't have the darkening
problem) =20

ThumbsPlus shows the colorspace as Uncalibrated too. (Both systems.)

If I tell CS to prompt when opening files with missing profiles, it
says the 10d images don't have an embedded profile, even the old ones.
I'll have to check on the Canon forum on DPreview about this. Both
systems have been automatically assigning AdobeRGB profiles to the 10D
images, but the main system has only recently started dimming them in
CS. =20

Something has happened that affects both applications.
--
Email reply: please remove one letter from each side of "@"
Spammers are Scammers. Exterminate them.