| Author |
New Web Designer Made Frames Site SEO?
|
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| paramindsoftware@gmail.com 2006-08-30, 6:43 pm |
| Hi,
I have a really interesting situation. I got my client #1 spots in
google and yahoo.
I'm not a web designer, and so when she wanted an upgraded look to her
site she
hired a guy who created a frames site, with only small room for text on
the site
hence cutting out keyword density.
This is the old site:
http://nutritiondesign.com/
This is the new site:
http://www.elston.net/nbd/
Not only does the index page of the new site have high rankings, the
other
pages do also.
I've seen online how search engines do not like redirects.
It seems like the new site should be completely redone and taken out
of frames, so we can keep the old names of the pages.
Any thoughts?
--
--
Robert Pearson
ParaMind Brainstorming Software http://www.paramind.net
Creative Virtue Press/Telical Books/Regenerative Music
http://www.rspearson.com
| |
| Andy Dingley 2006-08-30, 6:43 pm |
| > Any thoughts?
The old site wants a little updating work.
The new site wants throwing away entirely.
| |
| David Cary Hart 2006-08-30, 6:43 pm |
| On 30 Aug 2006 10:15:45 -0700, "Andy Dingley"
<dingbat@codesmiths.com> opined:
>
> The old site wants a little updating work.
>
> The new site wants throwing away entirely.
>
I concur. Frames are deprecated.
--
"Black Hole": The economic effect of administering a DNSBL
Our DNSBL - Eliminate Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com
Don't Subsidize Criminals: http://boulderpledge.org
| |
| paramindsoftware@gmail.com 2006-08-30, 6:43 pm |
|
David Cary Hart wrote:
> On 30 Aug 2006 10:15:45 -0700, "Andy Dingley"
> <dingbat@codesmiths.com> opined:
> I concur. Frames are deprecated.
>
> --
> "Black Hole": The economic effect of administering a DNSBL
> Our DNSBL - Eliminate Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com
> Don't Subsidize Criminals: http://boulderpledge.org
I really appreciate this. Any more people who may chime in will
really help.
--
--
Robert Pearson
ParaMind Brainstorming Software http://www.paramind.net
Creative Virtue Press/Telical Books/Regenerative Music
http://www.rspearson.com
| |
| Todd H. 2006-08-30, 6:43 pm |
| "paramindsoftware@XXXXXXXXXX" <paramindsoftware@XXXXXXXXXX> writes:
> I really appreciate this. Any more people who may chime in will
> really help.
Frames suck and always have. Dunno how they affect SEO, but from a
usability perspective they're terribly annoying.
Any design that dramatically alters the number of keywords or content
that's actually on the site (and perhaps not necessarily on the front
page) would be a bad idea if you like that #1 position you already
have. Leave well enough alone, I'd say.
I'd have to think there's hysteresis built into google's algorithms
though so that as long as your site still looks "relevant" (evne if
info is moved to a different page) its past performance should keep it
in the running.
Best Regards,
--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/
| |
|
| paramindsoftware@XXXXXXXXXX wrote:
> David Cary Hart wrote:
>
> I really appreciate this. Any more people who may chime in will
> really help.
My pleasure: I agree entirely. If they want the look of the new site,
just have a pro edit the first site to look like the second, but
without the accessibility problems.
(shameless plug: I could do it for them :-))
--
Els http://locusmeus.com/
Now playing: Genesis - Horizons
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| Charles Sweeney 2006-08-30, 6:43 pm |
| Els wrote
> My pleasure: I agree entirely. If they want the look of the new site,
> just have a pro edit the first site to look like the second, but
> without the accessibility problems.
> (shameless plug: I could do it for them :-))
I thought you said get a pro to do it?
(coat)
--
Charles Sweeney
http://CharlesSweeney.com
| |
|
| Charles Sweeney wrote:
> (coat)
And suitcase! <g>
--
Els http://locusmeus.com/
Now playing: Genesis - Supper's Ready
| |
| Rodney Pont 2006-08-30, 6:43 pm |
| On 30 Aug 2006 10:15:45 -0700, Andy Dingley wrote:
>
>The old site wants a little updating work.
>
>The new site wants throwing away entirely.
I agree. Why do people who create these things thing I'm going to be
encouraged to look around when they decide to resize my browser window?
Everything would have fitted in if they had left that alone. The only
good thing about in my view is that it did give me the option to skip
the flash introduction.
--
Regards - Rodney Pont
The from address exists but is mostly dumped,
please send any emails to the address below
e-mail ngpsm4 (at) infohitsystems (dot) ltd (dot) uk
| |
|
| Els wrote:
> Charles Sweeney wrote:
>
>
> And suitcase! <g>
[snip]
> Now playing: Genesis - Supper's Ready
Wrong timing too, Charles ;-)
--
Els http://locusmeus.com/
Now playing: Genesis - Supper's Ready
| |
| Charles Sweeney 2006-08-30, 6:43 pm |
| Els wrote
> Els wrote:
>
>
> [snip]
>
>
> Wrong timing too, Charles ;-)
Coat, suitcase and supper...I like the sound of that!
--
Charles Sweeney
http://CharlesSweeney.com
| |
|
| Charles Sweeney wrote:
> Els wrote
>
>
> Coat, suitcase and supper...I like the sound of that!
Rice, beans and chicken wings today ;-)
--
Els http://locusmeus.com/
Now playing: Genesis - The Musical Box
| |
| William Tasso 2006-08-30, 6:43 pm |
| Fleeing from the madness of the LocusMeus.com jungle
Els <els.aNOSPAM@tiscali.nl> stumbled into news:alt.www.webmaster
and said:
> Charles Sweeney wrote:
>
>
> Rice, beans and chicken wings today ;-)
Don't forget yer toothbrush
--
William Tasso
http://williamtasso.com/words/what-is-usenet.asp
| |
|
| William Tasso wrote:
> Fleeing from the madness of the LocusMeus.com jungle
> Els <els.aNOSPAM@tiscali.nl> stumbled into news:alt.www.webmaster
> and said:
>
>
> Don't forget yer toothbrush
And your umbrella :\
--
Els http://locusmeus.com/
Now playing: Genesis - Throwing It All Away
| |
| David Hennessy 2006-08-30, 10:46 pm |
| paramindsoftware@XXXXXXXXXX wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I have a really interesting situation. I got my client #1 spots in
> google and yahoo.
> I'm not a web designer, and so when she wanted an upgraded look to her
> site she
> hired a guy who created a frames site, with only small room for text on
> the site
> hence cutting out keyword density.
>
> This is the old site:
>
> http://nutritiondesign.com/
>
>
> This is the new site:
>
> http://www.elston.net/nbd/
>
>
> Not only does the index page of the new site have high rankings, the
> other
> pages do also.
>
> I've seen online how search engines do not like redirects.
>
> It seems like the new site should be completely redone and taken out
> of frames, so we can keep the old names of the pages.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
>
> --
I once handled a similar situation for a client this way: First, I
explained that search engines work by reading a page electronically (you
have to simplify a bit for non-geeks). You and I know this is the title
of the page because it's big and bold, but a search engine has to be
told that it's the title. The content is what's king, and having content
that uses proper HTML -- in addition to "looking good" -- is what makes
the difference between high search engine ranking, and invisibility.
Then I show them a page (usually one of mine) with good,
search-engine-readable HTML (just real quickly, on the screen).
Then I go to the frames site, go to view source, and let them see the
"empty" document. "This site is virtually invisible to Google."
'nuff said. :-)
--
David Hennessy
http://david.maidix.com/
| |
| SEOwebMarket.com 2006-08-31, 6:52 pm |
| > > hired a guy who created a frames site, with only small room for text on[color=darkred]
Frames, Flash, and other fun stuff is cool - but don't use it on a site
that expects new visitors to find you without being lead there by the
hand.
Frames are for non-commercial sites and very unique situations only.
There is normally a tiny bit of page text that can be salvaged from a
frames site - toss the rest.
| |
| Phil Payne 2006-08-31, 6:52 pm |
| Andy Dingley wrote:
>
> The old site wants a little updating work.
>
> The new site wants throwing away entirely.
Print the new one out. Wrap it round a brick. Throw it off a bridge
into a deep river. If its designer is in a canoe underneath, so much
the better.
I'm having the same discussion at the moment. Take a look at
http://www.thesheaf.me.uk vs
http://www.isham-research.co.uk/fb/index.html and then search for each
using keywords you find on them.
Guess which one makes the phone ring - the pretty one or the simple one?
| |
| Chaddy2222 2006-08-31, 6:52 pm |
|
paramindsoftware@XXXXXXXXXX wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I have a really interesting situation. I got my client #1 spots in
> google and yahoo.
> I'm not a web designer, and so when she wanted an upgraded look to her
> site she
> hired a guy who created a frames site, with only small room for text on
> the site
> hence cutting out keyword density.
>
> This is the old site:
>
> http://nutritiondesign.com/
>
>
> This is the new site:
>
> http://www.elston.net/nbd/
>
>
> Not only does the index page of the new site have high rankings, the
> other
> pages do also.
>
> I've seen online how search engines do not like redirects.
>
> It seems like the new site should be completely redone and taken out
> of frames, so we can keep the old names of the pages.
>
> Any thoughts?
The new site sucks and needs to be scrapt.
The old site is quite good and just needs updateing, some simple CSS
and good samantic markup would fix the problems. Also tables should not
be used for layout.
my article on why frames are bad is at:
http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc/design-tips1.html
I also have some other tips which might be good to read.
--
Regards Chad. http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc
| |
| William Tasso 2006-08-31, 6:52 pm |
| Fleeing from the madness of the http://groups.google.com jungle
Chaddy2222 <spamlovermailbox-sicurity@yahoo.com.au> stumbled into
news:alt.www.webmaster
and said:
> ...
> new site sucks and needs to be scrapt.
with apologies me ol' mate - usualy avoid highlighting typos[1], but
"scrapt"? don'cha just love that word :)
[1] assuming it was
--
William Tasso
http://williamtasso.com/words/what-is-usenet.asp
| |
| Chaddy2222 2006-08-31, 6:52 pm |
|
William Tasso wrote:
> Fleeing from the madness of the http://groups.google.com jungle
> Chaddy2222 <spamlovermailbox-sicurity@yahoo.com.au> stumbled into
> news:alt.www.webmaster
> and said:
>
>
> with apologies me ol' mate - usualy avoid highlighting typos[1], but
> "scrapt"? don'cha just love that word :)
>
> [1] assuming it was.
Yes, umm I believe I ment Scraped. It's just after 3 AM here, have been
and still am placeing the final tuchers on a new site i'm working on.
I have come to the concusion that I siriously should look at useing PHP
includes, cause adding links manually is kind of getting anoying!.
Overall it's not to bad though, comeing a long nicely.
--
Regards Chad.
Free Web Design Online! Free web design for community groups and
organisations.
http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc
| |
| William Tasso 2006-08-31, 6:52 pm |
| Fleeing from the madness of the http://groups.google.com jungle
Chaddy2222 <spamlovermailbox-sicurity@yahoo.com.au> stumbled into
news:alt.www.webmaster
and said:
>
> William Tasso wrote:
> Yes, umm I believe I ment Scraped.
hrmm - actually no, that doesn't do the job. try scrapped :)
> It's just after 3 AM here, have been
> and still am placeing the final tuchers on a new site i'm working on.
> I have come to the concusion that I siriously should look at useing PHP
> includes, cause adding links manually is kind of getting anoying!.
yep - code reuse is a life saver.
> Overall it's not to bad though, comeing a long nicely.
splendid news.
--
William Tasso
http://williamtasso.com/words/what-is-usenet.asp
| |
| blanketyblankman@gmail.com 2006-08-31, 11:03 pm |
|
Rodney Pont wrote:
> I agree. Why do people who create these things thing I'm going to be
> encouraged to look around when they decide to resize my browser window?
> Everything would have fitted in if they had left that alone. The only
> good thing about in my view is that it did give me the option to skip
> the flash introduction.
I didn't even bother looking around the site when that happened. I just
quit. If you want to resize someone's window (/me stabs the JS code in
the face), at least make sure you scale it to the right size (rather
than leaving a scroll bar). If you want to have your entire webpage fit
exactly in one window, scale the /page/, not the *window*!
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