VRML - how alive is VRML?

Author

how alive is VRML?

michael nieuwenhuizen

2004-01-08, 7:29 am

hello, i played around with VRML 1.0 when it had just come out,
and haven't touched it in years. now someone asked me to work
on a project that might include VRML, and i was wondering: how
alive is the language? i can't find any books on VRML in the local
bookshops here - not even the specialised computer bookshop -
while 5 years ago there was plenty of them. not a good sign if you
ask me. and many of the links to VRML pages i followed, or links
to VRML browsers were dead or seemed out-of-date.

so what's happening with VRML? i read something about VRML
in XML form - sounds very interesting, but is there a standard
yet? any pointers to where i can find info on the latest developments
in VRML? and if i decide to pick it up again: what would be a good
book to learn it from? i'm quite an experienced programmer and
have touched VRML before, so it should be an 'advanced' book.

thanks in advance,

mike

--
who knows he might find some biased opinions here

Lars J. Aas

2004-01-08, 7:29 am

In article <vvqd9rcb96oi2e@corp.supernews.com>,
michael nieuwenhuizen <usenet@mikkie.net> wrote:

quote:

> hello, i played around with VRML 1.0 when it had just come out,
> and haven't touched it in years. now someone asked me to work
> on a project that might include VRML, and i was wondering: how
> alive is the language?

Very much alive. VRML2.0 aka VRML97 came out in 1997, and was ammended
once in 2001 with some additional nodes for geo-stuff and NURBS.

quote:

> i can't find any books on VRML in the local
> bookshops here - not even the specialised computer bookshop -

Pfft. "Specialized computer bookshops" soon carries only Java, Excel,
and Access-books anyways. Check amazon and barnesandnoble on the web.

quote:

> while 5 years ago there was plenty of them. not a good sign if you
> ask me. and many of the links to VRML pages i followed, or links
> to VRML browsers were dead or seemed out-of-date.
>
> so what's happening with VRML? i read something about VRML
> in XML form - sounds very interesting, but is there a standard
> yet?

That's X3D. Yes, it has a standard. Don't know about implementations
though. In time it might become the next big thing, but to me it looks
most like a product of the "everything should be XML"-era. A lot of XML
formats haven't taken off because they are hopeless to work manually
with. VRML in ascii format is just so incredibly convenient to do by
hand compared to anything in XML. Programming against it through an
XML structure library can't possibly give you much, compared to
programming against native VRML nodes with an Open Inventor library.
To give up on all this convenience, it has to be freaking spectacular
what you get back - and I don't see what that is at least. Not yet.

quote:

> any pointers to where i can find info on the latest developments
> in VRML?

www.web3d.org
The site seems to be unreachable a lot, so do a google search for
"web3d vrml x3d" etc and pick another source of information - there
are lots of them.

quote:

> and if i decide to pick it up again: what would be a good
> book to learn it from? i'm quite an experienced programmer and
> have touched VRML before, so it should be an 'advanced' book.

The non-SGI Open Inventor implementations support VRML1.0 and VRML97.
For programming with Open Inventor, you have "The Inventor Mentor"
(the introductory book) and "The Inventor Toolmaker" (for advanced
users who are creating extensions). You also have reference
documentation for the API several places on the web. Specifically
for the VRML97 file format, you have "The Annotated VRML2.0 Reference
Manual", and you might want to read up on OpenGL if you need to do
custom extensions, not just extending the library with its own
building blocks.

SIM's Open Inventor implementation is named Coin and has a home on
www.coin3d.org (the server is currently down due to a disk-crash, but
might be up again when you read this, or if not, check again later).

TGS Open Inventor implementation is derived from SGI Open Inventor,
and can be read about on www.tgs.com.

SGI Open Inventor supports only VRML1.0, and can be found somewhere
in the Open Source section on www.sgi.com.

All this is C++ BTW - I don't know what kind of programming languages
you are custom to...

quote:

> mike
> --
> who knows he might find some biased opinions here

I'm biased towards Coin (I'm one of the Coin developers), but I try
to sound unbiased. [Note to self: What gives?]

Lars J
--
"People generally seem to want software to be free as in speech and/or
free as in beer. Unfortunately rather too much of it is free as in jazz."
/ Janet McKnight, on uk.misc

Joerg Scheurich aka MUFTI

2004-01-08, 8:31 am

> while 5 years ago there was plenty of them. not a good sign if you

quote:

> ask me. and many of the links to VRML pages i followed, or links
> to VRML browsers were dead or seemed out-of-date.

This is true. But there are also good news.
There is now a overwhelming number of modelling programs with VRML97
(and VRML1) export. Some modellers like 3D Studio MAX also have features
that come close to a VRML editor (the VRML97 export features of 3D Studio MAX
is a another story, some options ("e.g. flipchart animation") are really
useless...).
There are now some Open Source programs with VRML support/export, this
includes multiuser servers like vnet or vrspace, modellers like wings3d,
blender or art of illusion, vrml editors like white_dune or VRML libraries
like OpenVRML and browsers like xj3d, lookat or FreeWRL.

quote:

> so what's happening with VRML? i read something about VRML
> in XML form - sounds very interesting, but is there a standard
> yet?

The draft of the X3D (aka VRML200x) standard is now in the hand of the
ISO organisation.

quote:

> where i can find info on the latest developments
> in VRML?

http://www.web3d.org

$ telnet www.web3d.org 80
Trying 64.124.44.135...
telnet: connect to address 64.124.44.135: Connection timed out

Looks like, their webserver crashed today 8-(

"web3d" is the new name of the VRML consortium.

From time to time, www.web3d.org public the status of the current ISO
discussion about X3D in "specifications".

Currently it looks like, the old VRML97 files will be still valid
under X3D, even with the traditional VRML97 encoding.

quote:

> and if i decide to pick it up again: what would be a good
> book to learn it from? i'm quite an experienced programmer and
> have touched VRML before, so it should be an 'advanced' book.

If you have experience, if would recommend nothing else than the
ISO document at

http://www.web3d.org/technicalinfo/...rml97/index.htm

If you need to learn VRML from scratch, i recommend Floppys VRML97 tutorial
http://web3d.vapourtech.com/tutorials/vrml97/

so long
MUFTI
--
Micro$oft Visual Basic
Fuer das Thema "Hilfe" ist keine Hilfe verfuegbar
OK/Hilfe

muaddib

2004-01-08, 11:34 am

Michael,

michael nieuwenhuizen wrote:

quote:

> hello, i played around with VRML 1.0 when it had just come out,
> and haven't touched it in years. now someone asked me to work
> on a project that might include VRML, and i was wondering: how
> alive is the language?

i can't find any books on VRML in the local

quote:

> bookshops here - not even the specialised computer bookshop -
> while 5 years ago there was plenty of them. not a good sign if you
> ask me. and many of the links to VRML pages i followed, or links
> to VRML browsers were dead or seemed out-of-date.

I had a similar experience when trying to get into the subject. At
times I felt like I was surfing through the ghost town of the vrml
movement. Now I like to think of these sites as resources waiting to be
converted, and coordinated, into object libraries :) One of the most
exciting directions for VRML from my standpoint (and not suprising since
I am a VRSpace developer) is its use as the graphics format in
multi-user servers (to put the VR in VRML ;) ). I do prognosticate that
with the increasing number of internet users with broadband, you will
see this technology increasing, and for that matter, all streaming media
making large advances.
VRML is a well-documented graphics/animation standard. As MUFTI
pointed out, given the multitude of converters that exist out there, I
think part of the question turns into: How alive is 3D? The other part
is: how do easily ( and I mean point and click easy, not download, get
confused, ask a support forum "easy" ) can users view VRML versus other
other graphics formats? If you don't require Java, then there are many
open source and some commercial viewers available for VRML. As far as
I can see, there are two strong plugins with Java: Cortona, and Contact.
On the other hand, only two means fewer browser dependencies ( lol ).
There is also the entire Java3D side of loading and viewing the VRML.
What plugins are available for other graphics formats?

Muaddib

--
-------------------------------------------------------
VRSpace - An open source, 3D, modular, cross-platform,
multi-user system with persistent shared objects.
Check out a demo at http://www.vrspace.org/demo.htm
-------------------------------------------------------

Steve Smith

2004-01-08, 12:34 pm

> I can see, there are two strong plugins with Java: Cortona, and Contact.

quote:

> On the other hand, only two means fewer browser dependencies ( lol ).

There does seem to be sudden burst of strong new resources :-
www.octaga.com - is a player that matches Cortona and Contact
www.vizx3d.com - Virtock's new excellent low cost editor for VRML and X3D

Eckhard M. J?ger

2004-01-08, 10:32 pm

If you looking for a book about vrml:
http://www.web3d.org/resources/vrml...anual/Book.html

X3d resources:
http://www.web3d.org/specifications...9775/index.html
http://www.web3d.org/TaskGroups/x3d...s/contents.html
http://www.web3d.org/TaskGroups/x3d...k/contents.html
http://www.web3d.org/TaskGroups/x3d...3dTooltips.html

::Bart::VRMLsuck
http://www.neeneenee.de/vrml/
http://www.neeneenee.de/vrml/forum/

Dale

2004-01-09, 2:29 am

"Steve Smith" <steve@zanespray.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:btk089$dsv$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...

quote:

>
> There does seem to be sudden burst of strong new resources :-
> www.octaga.com - is a player that matches Cortona and Contact

I just tried the Octagon Freeplayer and didn't like it. My complaints:
1. my wrl file took much longer to load, navigation was unresponsive,
2. the quality of the scene was low and didn't change after I changed it in
Preferences,
3. only one kind of navigation was available (Examine),
4. keyboard shorcuts such as Page Up and Page Down for cycling through
viewpoints were unavailable,
5. the Ctrl-key modifier for changing navigation mode was unavailable.

So I uninstalled it and reinstalled Blaxxun Contact.

quote:

> www.vizx3d.com - Virtock's new excellent low cost editor for VRML and X3D

I tried this last week, and it choked on my large IndexedFaceSet, so I
uninstalled it. Thanks to the folks here, I was able to develop some VRML
code to help me apply map annotations by hand. Maybe I should develop these
further into an editor application?

michael nieuwenhuizen

2004-01-09, 7:28 am

thanks for all the answers, they have been really useful. if i have the
time
i will reply to them separately. for now one more question: what do people
use to create VRML? software like 3D studio max an export as VRML?
or special VRML software?

when i learned VRML ages ago i handcoded everything in a simple text
editor (as i think that's the best way to understand a language fully - i
think
people who create web sites in say dreamweaver and never look at the
source code of their output, don't take the program to its fullest
capabilities).

i think my project might involve blaxxun's platform (no idea what that
does), so the software i'd use would have to be able to exchange files
with that program.

mike

Joerg Scheurich aka MUFTI

2004-01-09, 9:29 am

quote:

> for now one more question: what do people
> use to create VRML? software like 3D studio max an export as VRML?
> or special VRML software?

quote:

> when i learned VRML ages ago i handcoded everything in a simple text
> editor ...
> people who create web sites in say dreamweaver and never look at the
> source code

For VRML creation, it is similar: it depends from personality

- "artistic" people like architects use their favourite modeller (like
maya, cinema4D etc.) and do not really come in touch with VRML commands.
The simply press "export" and often fail 8-( cause they and the VRML
exporter simply produce worlds, that do not care about the 3 deadly sins
of realtime 3D:
- too much polygons
- too thin walls
- too much lights
Of course, it is possible to use maya, 3D studio max, etc. as a low
polygon modeller, but this requires extra knowledge.
For "artistic" people, it may be a good advise to take a look at
some modellers like rhino3D or formZ which give you better control over
the most difficult problem: too much polygons.
Native "low polygon modellers" (like ac3d, wings3d etc.) can also be a good
advice.
A warning: the VRML97 export of some CAD/CAM programs are not intented for
realtime3D use, it is intended for exchanging data with other programs
("VRML97 is a ISO Fileformat for 3D data"). Cause the old VRML97 do not
know NURBS, only meshes, this tools create monster VRML files in
very high resolution (the machines the data is exchanged to can create
things with 1/100 millimeter exactness...)

- "programmer" people do anything with PROTOs and Scripts and touch
mesh data only via "Inline". Beside a VRML browser, they mainly use
text editors, some use specialised VRML texteditors like VRMLpad.

- some specialised VRML tools ("graphical VRML editors" like cosmoworlds,
spazz3d, white_dune etc.) try to be usefull for both worlds.
They give "artistic" people - that would die if they would need to type
"{" 8-) a chance to come in touch with the VRML commands itself
and "programmer" people a acceptable way to change graphical things
(like colors) in a graphical way.

Personally, i mainly use white_dune for creating VRML worlds - despite
i have a legal cosmoworlds license on the old SGI on my desktop - cause i
search for errors in white_dune itself 8-)

quote:

> i think my project might involve blaxxun's platform (no idea what that
> does), so the software i'd use would have to be able to exchange files
> with that program.

Having a ISO standard (and the possiblity to exchanged platforms) is a
great value by itself.
You should think twice before you give up ISO conformance intentionally.

Of course the blaxxun tools confirms to ISO/IEC 14772 (VRML97).
At least, it breaks the standards only in a few details, not much more or
less, than most of the other big competitors.
Some of the blaxxun extensions drove X3D features, but currently e.g. the fate
of the NURBS nodes in VRML97 Amendmend 1 (which is supported by blaxxun cc3d,
cortona und even cosmoplayer (via http://www.csv.ica.uni-stuttgart.de...face/index.html)
only partitially) is unclear, cause the documents about NURBS in the current
X3D discussion now look different 8-(

When you use extensions, take care about Annex F of ISO/IEC 14772,
http://www.web3d.org/technicalinfo/...extensions.html
it shows, how you can use browser extensions and still keep a valid
VRML97 file.
I would not use browser extensions that can not be written down in
compliance with Annex F of ISO/IEC 14772.

so long
MUFTI
--
Dieses Programm stellt SCSI-Kennung gebrauchten auf Ihrer
Anlage fest und empfiehlt einen erhaeltlichen Kennung,
anschliessen ein NEUES Laufwerk.

Gianni Dragone

2004-01-09, 11:30 am

"michael nieuwenhuizen" <usenet@mikkie.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:vvt428gn02vu73@corp.supernews.com...

quote:

> thanks for all the answers, they have been really useful. if i have the
> time
> i will reply to them separately. for now one more question: what do

people

quote:

> use to create VRML? software like 3D studio max an export as VRML?
> or special VRML software?

Have a look to what is possible to create with VRML in about 135 Kb :
http://www.int3d.com/3dscenes/savoye/savoye.html
and you dont even need to know VRML

Gianni Dragone

boris

2004-01-09, 1:30 pm

"Gianni Dragone" <dragogio@tin.it> wrote

quote:

>
> "michael nieuwenhuizen" <usenet@mikkie.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
> news:vvt428gn02vu73@corp.supernews.com...
> people
>
> Have a look to what is possible to create with VRML in about 135 Kb :
> http://www.int3d.com/3dscenes/savoye/savoye.html
> and you dont even need to know VRML
>
> Gianni Dragone

Very nice.
I always liked La Corbusier.

michael nieuwenhuizen

2004-01-09, 2:29 pm

"Gianni Dragone" <dragogio@tin.it> wrote

quote:

>
> Have a look to what is possible to create with VRML in about 135 Kb :
> http://www.int3d.com/3dscenes/savoye/savoye.html

is it me or have the walls and floors disappeared?

mike

Gianni Dragone

2004-01-09, 2:29 pm

"michael nieuwenhuizen" <usenet@mikkie.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:vvtqfa3r2er50f@corp.supernews.com...

quote:

>
> "Gianni Dragone" <dragogio@tin.it> wrote
>
> is it me or have the walls and floors disappeared?

Walls of the first floor disappear when the camera goes up to 2.5 meters .
If it is this what you mean ...Otherways try Blaxxun or Cortona as viewer .

Gonzalo Scotti

2004-01-09, 5:30 pm

I think you are right somehow about the personality types. Being Myself an
"artistic" guy.
But in the past I have created models using 3dMax to generate the maps and
VRMLPad to create the world and to learn the language.
The thing is that when you create some more complex worlds or machinery or
whatever, handcoding the geometry becomes totally impractical, IMHO. So I
think it also depends on the geometric complexity of the model.

my 2 cents

--
Gonzalo Scotti
Project Architect
Martin A.D. Yabor & Assoc., Inc.

"Joerg Scheurich aka MUFTI" <rusmufti@helpdesk.rus.uni-stuttgart.de> wrote
in message news:btm7f7$efp$1@news.uni-stuttgart.de...

quote:

>
>
>
> For VRML creation, it is similar: it depends from personality
>
> - "artistic" people like architects use their favourite modeller (like
> maya, cinema4D etc.) and do not really come in touch with VRML commands.
> The simply press "export" and often fail 8-( cause they and the VRML
> exporter simply produce worlds, that do not care about the 3 deadly sins
> of realtime 3D:
> - too much polygons
> - too thin walls
> - too much lights
> Of course, it is possible to use maya, 3D studio max, etc. as a low
> polygon modeller, but this requires extra knowledge.
> For "artistic" people, it may be a good advise to take a look at
> some modellers like rhino3D or formZ which give you better control over
> the most difficult problem: too much polygons.
> Native "low polygon modellers" (like ac3d, wings3d etc.) can also be a

good

quote:

> advice.
> A warning: the VRML97 export of some CAD/CAM programs are not intented

for

quote:

> realtime3D use, it is intended for exchanging data with other programs
> ("VRML97 is a ISO Fileformat for 3D data"). Cause the old VRML97 do not
> know NURBS, only meshes, this tools create monster VRML files in
> very high resolution (the machines the data is exchanged to can create
> things with 1/100 millimeter exactness...)
>
> - "programmer" people do anything with PROTOs and Scripts and touch
> mesh data only via "Inline". Beside a VRML browser, they mainly use
> text editors, some use specialised VRML texteditors like VRMLpad.
>
> - some specialised VRML tools ("graphical VRML editors" like cosmoworlds,
> spazz3d, white_dune etc.) try to be usefull for both worlds.
> They give "artistic" people - that would die if they would need to type
> "{" 8-) a chance to come in touch with the VRML commands itself
> and "programmer" people a acceptable way to change graphical things
> (like colors) in a graphical way.
>
> Personally, i mainly use white_dune for creating VRML worlds - despite
> i have a legal cosmoworlds license on the old SGI on my desktop - cause i
> search for errors in white_dune itself 8-)
>
>
> Having a ISO standard (and the possiblity to exchanged platforms) is a
> great value by itself.
> You should think twice before you give up ISO conformance intentionally.
>
> Of course the blaxxun tools confirms to ISO/IEC 14772 (VRML97).
> At least, it breaks the standards only in a few details, not much more or
> less, than most of the other big competitors.
> Some of the blaxxun extensions drove X3D features, but currently e.g. the

fate

quote:

> of the NURBS nodes in VRML97 Amendmend 1 (which is supported by blaxxun

cc3d,

quote:

> cortona und even cosmoplayer (via

http://www.csv.ica.uni-stuttgart.de...face/index.html)

quote:

> only partitially) is unclear, cause the documents about NURBS in the

current

quote:

> X3D discussion now look different 8-(
>
> When you use extensions, take care about Annex F of ISO/IEC 14772,
>

http://www.web3d.org/technicalinfo/...extensions.html

quote:

> it shows, how you can use browser extensions and still keep a valid
> VRML97 file.
> I would not use browser extensions that can not be written down in
> compliance with Annex F of ISO/IEC 14772.
>
> so long
> MUFTI
> --
> Dieses Programm stellt SCSI-Kennung gebrauchten auf Ihrer
> Anlage fest und empfiehlt einen erhaeltlichen Kennung,
> anschliessen ein NEUES Laufwerk.

michael nieuwenhuizen

2004-01-09, 6:30 pm

"Gianni Dragone" <dragogio@tin.it> wrote

quote:

>
> Walls of the first floor disappear when the camera goes up to
> 2.5 meters . If it is this what you mean ...

no, the walls & floors simply never appeared. and now i've tried
again and the trees & the ground don't show up.

quote:

> Otherways try Blaxxun or Cortona as viewer .

i got the viewer from blaxxun.

mike

Gianni Dragone

2004-01-09, 6:30 pm

"michael nieuwenhuizen" <usenet@mikkie.net> ha scritto nel >

quote:

> no, the walls & floors simply never appeared. and now i've tried
> again and the trees & the ground don't show up.

On modern computers with standard configuration there is no problem .

Gianni

michael nieuwenhuizen

2004-01-10, 1:28 am

"Gianni Dragone" <dragogio@tin.it> wrote

quote:

>
> On modern computers with standard configuration there is no problem .

define "modern computer" and "standard configuration".

mike

--
who has a (standard) dell with P4 & win2k pro

boris

2004-01-10, 7:29 am

"Gonzalo Scotti" <scottig@bellsouth.net> wrote

quote:

> I think you are right somehow about the personality types. Being Myself an
> "artistic" guy.
> But in the past I have created models using 3dMax to generate the maps and
> VRMLPad to create the world and to learn the language.
> The thing is that when you create some more complex worlds or machinery or
> whatever, handcoding the geometry becomes totally impractical, IMHO. So I
> think it also depends on the geometric complexity of the model.
>
> my 2 cents

Well spent.

I'm in group of "artistic" types, too, and for me 3d max is main source for
generating vrlm files. I look for vrlm software with grafic interface
sofisticated enough to produce objects whose complexity is even close to 3d
maxes. But on the other hand, export feature of max makes it such software,
despite the fact it is polygon oriented.

Eckhard M. J?ger

2004-01-10, 8:29 am

I Think standard level of computer is something around 600Mhz and a 3d
graphiccard from Geforce 1 level as minimum. Today computers for
beginners (cheapes, entry level) are overall two times faster (real
power not only numbers).
This means it is possible to use 5000 visible polygons on fullscreen
at 1024*768.

::VRMLsuck::Bart
http://www.neeneenee.de/vrml/
http://www.neeneenee.de/vrml/forum/

Joe D Williams

2004-01-11, 2:29 pm

Re: how alive is VRML?

I would say that VRML is as alive as the X3D Graphics International Standard
allows it to be. The Classic VRML syntax is improved and extended and some
interesting evolution has occurred, allowing more predictable interaction with
your own and other's creations.

MUFTI > breaks the standards only in a few details, not much more or

quote:

> less, than most of the other big competitors.
> drove X3D features, but currently e.g. the fate
> of the NURBS nodes in VRML97 Amendmend 1
> (which is supported by blaxxun cc3d,
> cortona und even cosmoplayer (via

http://www.csv.ica.uni-stuttgart.de...surface/index.h
tml)

quote:

> only partitially) is unclear, cause the documents about NURBS in the current
> X3D discussion now look different 8-(

http://www.web3d.org/specifications/
ISO-IEC-19775/Part01/components/nurbs.html

http://www.web3d.org/technicalinfo/specifications/
ISO_IEC_14772-All/part1/nodesRef.html

At this time, to me, this apparent divergence can be as simple as
a set of related typographical errors in the current X3D abstract spec,
or the collection of changes may just be a lot better way to solve the
problem. If the latter is true, what we may be concerned with is an
issue of how the current X3D NURBS would seriously invalidate
great amounts of VRML97 NURBS content.
The biggest differnce in this regard is the change
to NurbsSet from NurbsGroup
and the contents of their children, but first let's look at some
of the other changes, which I think would be of much greater importance
to someone getting to know X3D NURBS.

NurbsCurve = NurbsCurve

metadata tessellation weight knot order
X3D adds closed
and X3D can use CoordinateDouble!

from NurbsSurface
to NurbsPatchSurface and NurbsTrimmedSurface

metadata texCoord uTessellation vTessellation weight
solid uClosed uDimension uKnot uOrder vClosed
vDimension vKnot vOrder

X3D no ccw
X3D new uClosed

So the new patchsurface is the old nurbssurface
and then the TrimmedSurface is just like that except
it adds the inputOutput fields for the trimming surfaces.
Simple enough translation to enjoy the improvement?

Then there are other apparent improvements also.
Which is the most fun to discuss?

Thank You and Best Regards,
Joe

PrisNo6

2004-01-11, 10:29 pm

"Joe D Williams" <joedwil@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<QsgMb.4223$1e.925@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>...

quote:

> Re: how alive is VRML?

Joe wrote:

quote:

> I would say that VRML is as alive as the X3D Graphics International Standard
> allows it to be. The Classic VRML syntax is improved and extended and some
> interesting evolution has occurred, allowing more predictable interaction
> with your own and other's creations.

While VRML properly is being superceded by its improved child X3D,
most players for X3D that I am aware of are still in the beta stage.
Non-VRML non-computer literate users can be coaxed into loading a
simple, well-tested browser plug-in like Cortona, CosmoPlayer or
Blaxxun.

X3D players do not seem that developed.

This limits the current ability of X3D to be used as a communciation
tool over the web with the general non-computer literate public.
Similarly, Java 3D suffers from the difficulty of convincing a
non-computer literate public to install the Java runtime version and
then a separate java player application. Many network supervisors are
unwilling to install Java on commercial MS operating systems, being
already swamped with capatability and upgrade headaches inherent in
the MS OS technology.

X3D will become the dominate VRML-type language, but IMHO it will
happen over the next year as well-tested, reliable, freeware browser
plug-in players become available. Such reliable freeware players will
be accepted by the public.

Or perhaps such players already exist and I am simply ignorant of
them. If so, please give me some links. I am ready to move on to
X3D, but am delaying because of the above issue.

Regards - Kurt

PrisNo6

2004-01-13, 5:30 pm

"Steve Smith" <steve@zanespray.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message news:<btk089$dsv$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk>...

quote:

>
> There does seem to be sudden burst of strong new resources :-
> www.octaga.com - is a player that matches Cortona and Contact
> www.vizx3d.com - Virtock's new excellent low cost editor for VRML and X3D

I have been browsing what X3D players are available, but have not yet
installed any. To narrow my choices, which of the currently
implemented browsers support script nodes and scripts translated from
VRML. For example, Blaxxun web site documentation states that they do
not support scripts under X3D, but directs the user to their API. The
www.vizx3d.com site talks about their testing porting VRML objects to
X3D, but makes no mention of porting script behaviors.

What is the current status of script support under these beta viewers,
i.e. -

Octaga
Flux
Vizx3d
web3d's extensions to java3d (appears to support script nodes)?

Just trying to narrow things done before installing - Thanks Kurt