Stylesheets - This is probably a common question

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This is probably a common question - What is the best CSS editor?

Jim

2004-08-18, 11:15 pm

This is probably a common question - What is the best CSS editor? I'm an old HTML dinosaur
that just getting into CSS. My HTML editor from way back is Homesite. They (Macromedia) tout
Topstyle Pro but I wonder what the professionals use.

Dave Patton

2004-08-18, 11:15 pm

Jim <stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com> wrote in
news:MPG.1b8dd022a3ab667e989692@news.comcast.giganews.com:

> This is probably a common question - What is the best CSS editor?

In your household, that thing between your ears ;-)
(or perhaps, that thing between her ears :-)

--
Dave Patton
Canadian Coordinator, Degree Confluence Project
http://www.confluence.org/
My website: http://members.shaw.ca/davepatton/

Jim

2004-08-18, 11:15 pm

In article <Xns9549C06B83785mrzaphoddirectcaold@24.71.223.159>, spam@trap.invalid says...
> Jim <stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com> wrote in
> news:MPG.1b8dd022a3ab667e989692@news.comcast.giganews.com:
>
>
> In your household, that thing between your ears ;-)
> (or perhaps, that thing between her ears :-)
>
>
O.K. the second best editor. The one I can install on my computer. The one I can use for
converting old HTML pages. That kind.

Jukka K. Korpela

2004-08-19, 4:17 am

Jim <stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com> wrote:

BTW, if you think it is a common question, why didn't you look at the
FAQs and archives?
[color=darkred]
> O.K. the second best editor. The one I can install on my computer.

Why can't you install her? You mean she's _human_? How intriguing
old-fashionedness.

> The one I can use for converting old HTML pages. That kind.

Oh. It seems that your _real_ question was how to convert old HTML pages
to more or less Strict HTML, delegating presention to CSS. The short
answer is: don't. The longer answer is: you could do it, but any attempts
to automate it will kick back, though you might be able to automate
_parts_ thereof if you are cautious _and_ know exactly what to do (just
don't bother doing it all by hand). Tools like HTML-Kit will often make
the situation worse by turning <font> stuff to <span> stuff with fancy
class names.

Use more or less Strict HTML and well-designed CSS for _new_ pages.
Writing CSS by hand is the simplest way*), but don't forget to use a
checker (like the "CSS Validator" from W3C) - even experts make mistakes
even in writing one-liners.
*) Disclaimer: There might be useful programs for writing CSS in a manner
that takes care of checking for syntax errors automatically and helps you
by showing the alternatives at each point, and even lets you preview the
appearance smoothly. But I haven't met them.

--
Yucca, http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

Neal

2004-08-19, 4:17 am

On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 22:18:40 -0400, Jim <stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com>
wrote:

> The (CSS editor) I can use for
> converting old HTML pages. That kind.

Jim, don't try to "convert" table layout to CSS. That's like converting a
meat pie to a plate of brockwurst.

Here's how to do it in one of a few right ways:

1) Learn CSS. The hard way. If you don't know it already, learn HTML 4.01
Strict too. Do a lot of little learning projects and look at a lot of CSS
designs for ideas. Also get to know what CSS cannot do, thanks to either a
lack of support or a major browser which doesn't follow the specs.

2) Look at your site. What is really essential about the design? Decide to
keep it or redesign.

3) Most important - find a way to redo it so that you take advantage of
all the things you can do better for your visitors with CSS.

Sorry, no machine can do that. You really must either learn CSS yourself
or pay someone to do it.

bulge

2004-08-19, 1:21 pm

On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 22:18:40 -0400, Jim <stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com>
wrote:

>In article <Xns9549C06B83785mrzaphoddirectcaold@24.71.223.159>, spam@trap.invalid says...
>O.K. the second best editor. The one I can install on my computer. The one I can use for
>converting old HTML pages. That kind.

Give TopStyle www.bradsoft.com and Style Master www.westciv.com a
shot. Each program has its strengths and weaknesses, but both helped
me get around the millions of new things I had to familiarise myself
with with CSS.

But beyond that I'd have to agree on the 'learning the hard way'
school of thought. IE is a major pain in the arse, and dissecting
sites and solving real problems (taking into account the bugs,
predominantly in IE) is the only real solution for CSS nirvana (if it
can be called that). I have spent more time googling and reading CSS
articles and doing tutorials than anything else.

Anway, the problem with both those programs is they use IE as the
"preview"...and TopStyle can't preview properly in Firefox from its
toolbar (at least no way I could find). You can, of course, paste the
local address in Firefox and preview that way.

kaeli

2004-08-19, 1:21 pm

In article <MPG.1b8dd022a3ab667e989692@news.comcast.giganews.com>,
stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com enlightened us with...
> This is probably a common question - What is the best CSS editor?

Notepad. ;)

--
--
~kaeli~
A lot of money is tainted - It taint yours and it taint mine.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

John

2004-08-19, 1:21 pm

On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 21:44:52 -0400, Jim <stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com>
wrote:

>This is probably a common question - What is the best CSS editor? I'm an old HTML dinosaur
>that just getting into CSS. My HTML editor from way back is Homesite. They (Macromedia) tout
>Topstyle Pro but I wonder what the professionals use.

I would certainly rate Topstyle 3 Pro as an editor. You can even
preview your pages in real time to see any changes you've made in the
css.

Jim

2004-08-19, 1:21 pm

In article <Xns954A510AC34B3jkorpelacstutfi@193.229.0.31>, jkorpela@cs.tut.fi says...
> Jim <stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com> wrote:
>
>
> BTW, if you think it is a common question, why didn't you look at the
> FAQs and archives?
>

It's a bad habit of mine. One I'm trying to break. I get on some new newsgroup and ask a
question, hit the enter button, then think, maybe I should have googled that one first.

I apologize if I have ruffled any feathers.

I will go and sin no more.

Jim

2004-08-19, 1:21 pm

In article <opscyrctqy6v6656@news.individual.net>, neal413@yahoo.com says...
> On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 22:18:40 -0400, Jim <stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> Jim, don't try to "convert" table layout to CSS. That's like converting a
> meat pie to a plate of brockwurst.
>

Thanks. It's how I learned HTML. Using a text editor. Jeeze, I can't believe how long it's
taken me to come around to CSS.

It's so beautiful.

I'm in the process of learning CSS by adapting MovableType style sheets (or one version at
least) to static pages for multi-page sites.

I'll ask this question, then go off to google it anyway.

What's your favorite CSS book?

:-)

Stephen Poley

2004-08-19, 10:38 pm

On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:55:20 -0500, kaeli <tiny_one@NOSPAM.comcast.net>
wrote:

>In article <MPG.1b8dd022a3ab667e989692@news.comcast.giganews.com>,
>stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com enlightened us with...
>
>Notepad. ;)

If Notepad is the answer, it must have been a silly question. ;-)

Dunno what the best editor is, but I'm quite certain that NoteTab is
better than Notepad.

--
Stephen Poley

http://www.xs4all.nl/~sbpoley/webmatters/

Stephen Poley

2004-08-21, 7:25 pm

Grant

2004-08-22, 7:17 pm

On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:55:20 -0500, kaeli
<tiny_one@NOSPAM.comcast.net> wrote:

> In article <MPG.1b8dd022a3ab667e989692@news.comcast.giganews.com>,
> stoicREMOVEjim@aequalis.com enlightened us with...
>
> Notepad. ;)

Nah... Vim! Syntax highlighting programmer's editor from the
unix world, www.vim.org, available for Win32 too.

Cheers,
Grant.

Dave Patton

2004-08-23, 7:19 pm

Brian

2004-08-23, 7:19 pm

Grant wrote:

> Vim! Syntax highlighting programmer's editor from the
> unix world, www.vim.org, available for Win32 too.

I got the Win32 version, and played with it a little. But it doesn't
seem to offer what NoteTab Light offers: programming clips, macros,
etc., to speed up html and css authoring. (MySQL, PHP, etc. are also
available.) For example, I can click my mouse pointer on font-weight
text in the clip bar, get a prompt with choices like "normal" and
"bold". Select one, and the editor inserts "font-weight: bold;" in my
css file. Rather nice. Does Vim offer that? Any other www authoring
goodies that I may be missing?

--
Brian (remove ".invalid" to email me)
http://www.tsmchughs.com/

John

2004-08-23, 7:19 pm